Health certifications for working dogs

[borderlicious]

I'm in the process of looking for a female BC pup out of working parents and have come across a few ranchers with puppies available. I wanted to bring a puppy home today but I had a dilemma - these people didn't x-ray/OFA their dogs' hips and elbows. They tested the eyes, and that was it.

Apparently, they choose to judge the dog's soundness by its performance as a working dog instead of getting certifications. They figure if the dog can run 50+ miles a day, move with the agility and speed needed for stock work and handle their physically challenging job, the dog is sound enough to be bred.

I can see a lot of merit to this belief - a dog can pass all its OFA tests, but if it isn't structurally sound it won't be able to work (I'm not talking about "pretty", just functional soundness) I don't see how a dog capable of doing that kind of work on a daily basis can be considered unsound. However, there is something reassuring to me about knowing that the dogs behind my dog are certified free of major health problems.

 

Thoughts on this? Should I avoid breeders who do not do OFA testing? I am relatively new to the world of the working BC and I'd like opinions on this before I continue looking for a pup.

 

-Grace and Dakota

[juliepoudrier]

I think it's important to remember that OFA certification of the parents isn't a guarantee that pups won't have HD or develop the associated osteoarthritis later in life. Also there are a number of folks, including the ABCA, who don't think OFA is necessarily the best way to judge a border collie's hips (hence the Cornell system). Granted, the odds are better for HD free pups if you know you are breeding "tested" dogs, but I suppose it comes down to your "comfort factor." If you are uncomfortable with the situation, then don't get a pup.

 

AFAIK, elbow dysplasia isn't a big problem in the working bred population, so I wouldn't let lack of OFA certification there deter me.

 

I think more breeders will test hips as more buyers demand it, but I think buyers should educate themselves thoroughly on the genetic issues that are of concern to the working-bred dogs and what tests are available and why some are preferred over others.

 

Just my opinion.

 

Here are some past discussions on HD and HD testing. You should read through these to gain a better understanding of what people think about testing and why.

 

http://www.bordercollie.org/cgi-bin/ultima...t=000932#000003

 

http://www.bordercollie.org/cgi-bin/ultima...t=001010#000005

 

http://www.bordercollie.org/cgi-bin/ultima...t=001515#000000

 

http://www.bordercollie.org/cgi-bin/ultima...t=001603#000000

 

There are plenty of other threads on the topic. Use the search function (top right of the screen) and type in "dysplasia" to find them. You could also search "OFA" and see what comes up.

 

J.

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

Two things I look at when considering "working" tested dogs:

 

Is the extent of the work truly thorough enough to assure me that the dog must be sound? You'll get many, many farmers and unscrupulous breeders who will claim all kinds of things - get to know the operation and how the dog or dogs you are considering fit into it. What's a typical day's work like? What kind of work is done in the peak season? What is the minimum work that needs to be done during the slack season and how long does that season last? Do the dogs work in a wide range of temps, on and off the ranch, and over a reasonably varied terrain?

 

The second thing is simple - how old is the dog or dogs and how long has the dog actually been "employed" full time on the operation? For lines that are totally unfamiliar to me, or inexperienced breeders, I prefer a dog that is at least four years old, with at least two years of full time top level work behind it. More experienced breeders and trainers can catch problems earlier, but I consider some risk to still be present in these cases.

 

Just like clinical screening, these considerations won't guarantee soundness. Ideally, both can work together to give the breeder a fuller picture of their dogs' health.

 

In all cases, I'd advise you to only work with a breeder that has an acceptable policy to cover any possible soundness issues that might arise. The breeder might have this outlined in advance, or you may have to hash it out between you, but this precaution helps to clarify any expectations you have and protect you both from future misunderstandings.

[punkrockbc]

Wonderful advice from Julie & Rebecca!

 

You should definitely do what you feel comfortable with. =0) That is my opinion. A contract should absolutely stand behind the structural soundness of your pup for at least 2 years, though! Gonzo is from a breeder who also did not check hips/elbows, and admittedly did not have the best breeding practices, but their dogs worked over 100's of acres every single season and if a dog did not work exceptionally well it was not kept and especially not bred. Gonzo's hips & elbows are awesome... although he has shyness & insecurity issues resulting from other poor breeding practices, as the pups were outside alone from day 1 and were not well socialized. Keep your eye out for breeders who raise puppies in-home, and/or spend lots of time handling & socializing the pups.

 

My sister's family has a Lab, on the other hand, whose parents *were* tested and cleared, but he had both hip & elbow issues by the time he was 12 months old. A very clear guarentee on genetic health issues in the breeder's contract gave them the option of either a free puppy while keeping their Lab, or the breeder returning half the cost of their dog. They opted to get back half of the puppy price which went toward paying for a hip surgery.

[borderlicious]

Thank you Julie, Rebecca and Erica. Interesting discussions, Julie... There is so is much info on this board :eek: I haven't even scratched the surface it seems.

I've decided that I am not comfortable with the practices of two of the breeders I've been speaking with, but it seems to me that one is fairly responsible. The dam of the litter is 8 years old, she has worked sheep and cattle since she was a youngster. The sire works a cattle ranch several hours away, and has worked sheep as well. The puppies are being raised on the breeder's ranch and according to what I have heard, are bold and well-socialized. I'm hoping to drive out to her ranch this weekend to visit.

 

Thanks again for the help!