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Howdyjabo

why have breeding restrictions

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The other topic was getting too unwieildy so I'm moving

 

Everyone should have some kind of restriction

 

Be it Spay/Neuter-- No papers-- or NB Papers

 

It helps control alot of things

 

But it most helps me identify the people that I don't even want to have one of my dogs-wether they breed it or not.

 

If I sell pups for $200/no papers and $450 papered

And someone asks me for the papered version.

My RED FLAG is triggered and I really get to trying to understand what is motivating this buy.

 

And it eliminates those that I don't want to talk to anyhow from even bothering to contact me.

 

And the buyers are usually tickled pink to get a cheaper dog--- they aren't even thinking about breeding then(that usually comes latter-and by then its too late).

 

Spay /neuter-- I don't trust people that much

And they still have papers propagating the idea that the papers alone make the dog better- Not a pyhsical problem(if they actually did spay ) but its a mental process that irritates me.

 

NB - doesn't stop them from registering in another registry- and they still have that idea that "I have papers " I can show them to someone and it adds value to my dog.

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Someone asked whether ACK will take NB papers. I think the answer was no but someone can confirm for mee, I'm sure.

 

Melanie and Eileen are both at trials this weekend - WHERE are their priorities? :rolleyes: We'll have to bump this up if we haven't gotten an answer.

 

As to why - two words - or maybe three? - backyard breeders. And I include in that anyone who breeds Border collies for any reason other than producing livestock working dogs.

 

If the BYBs can't get breeding stock, they'll go back to breeding Aussies, Jack Russells, and ACDs.

 

I would never want to see my name on the papers of a rescue, even a generation or two back (after that, it's a bit out of anyone's control). I had a friend who bred her pet Border collie to antoher pet Border collie and years later got a pair of pups in that were grandpups of that dog. She had sold the pup on a spay/neuter contract but they had gone back on their word. Then THOSE people sold the pups in a newspaper ad - ABCA REGISTERED Border collie pups - red and b/w If the papers were withheld or NB they wouldn't have been tempted, perhaps.

 

I have another friend who with holds papers until the pups have either been speutered or until they've proven to her satisfaction that they are working to a pretty high level and have had hips xrayed and eyes done. she started doing that after SHE got screwed on a speuter contract.

 

With holding papers or NBing is the only way to go, to make sure. Or early sterilization! You only have to keep the pups one more month to do three-month spays or neuters. Of course that would make the majority of the sport people go somewhere else.

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If they have the papers even NB -- they still get this idea that the dog has genetic value-and a piece of paper to proove it. And there are people that buy into that-- even if they know they can't register the pups-- its a marketing tool I'm not gonna give them.

 

Or god help us use those papers to start up their own registry -- I don't trust AKC even if they turn them down now-- things get tight they'll take'em.

 

No papers...... all they get is-- she said this dog was pure bred--I saw the parents papers--- but I don't even remeber who its parents were.

All they have is a good DOG -just as it should be.

 

It does nothing to keep that dog from having generic puppies like a sppeuter contract

But thats not my main concern in life- know it should matter- like it does to some people- but it doesn't...yet.

 

 

I don't want to have to go checking around after them- getting litigious ect...

and I won't give them the papers-speutered or not

to encourage them to do it.

I have thought about charging a little more... and give a refund for proof of speuter.

 

 

Problem with all these is that unless it becomes the norm to have a breeding restriction policy. those that do it may suffer market losses to those who don't. So we end up with more BYB breedings and less of the good ones.

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CONTRACT FOR NON-BREEDING STATUS

American Border Collie Association

 

ABCA REGISTERED DOG

 

I, __________, as breeder of a dog whelped on _______, 2005, out of the Sire _______ ABC# _______ and Dam _______ ABC# _________, request that a Non-Breeding status be placed on this dog, a (male/female) to be registered to John Doe, owner of record with the American Border Collie Association, Inc. This Non-Breeding status will not allow any offspring of the above mentioned dog to be registered (with any registry). It is understood that the breeder can remove the Non-Breeding status in the future, but that it requires the signature of the breeder and original owner of the above mentioned dog.

 

Name of dog: ____________

 

ABCA No. Assigned: _______

 

Signed this ___________________ day of ______________, 20____.

 

 

_________________________________

John Doe, Breeder

 

 

I agree to the above mentioned breeding restrictions on the above referenced dog.

 

_________________________________

Jane Doe, Original owner of dog.

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With so many using computers today, why can?t we sale a pup on a spay/neuter contract with non-breeding agreement and register the dog in the name of the breeder. Then supply a ?pedigree? certificate to the ?pet? buyer that we make from our own computer. Would work if the registries had not ?educated? folks that registration was value. I still do not see how most can enforce a spay/neuter contract. Just like many restrict registering their ABCA pup in the other registry. But who actually has the money to sue the buyer if they violate the contract. I sold a pup for $500. Health guarantee included. Yet at age 2year 11 months it test CEA ?affected?. Will they spend $2500 in attorney retainer, $1000+ in travel expenses, then motel cost and more. As a breeder, can I afford to sue a buyer because they failed to spay/neuter? Will the court actually uphold the contract?

 

I guess the question should be, has anyoner had to enforce, in court, one of these type of contracts?

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