Too fat, more walks?

[BorderWolf]

Hello!

 

my Border Collie, Bingo is a short haired Border Collie and he weighs like 65LBS, (hes a big dog) is that too fat for a Border Collie?

[cgt]

Border Collies come in a variety of shapes, sizes and colors. It seems to me that 65 lbs is on the big side of average, but your dog could certainly be at the proper weight. My 3 Border Collies run in the 35-42 lb range. In my (admittedly limited) experience, most non-working dogs are overweight, though. (The working ones can get overweight, too, of course. But their owners are usually pretty fanatical about keeping their dogs fit so they perform at their best.)

 

Different dogs need different amounts of food, and the type of food matters here, also. My dogs, who work sheep just about every day, get 2-2 1/2 cups of food a day.

 

With my Border Collies I learned (somewhere - maybe even here) to monitor their weight in two ways.

 

(1) I like to be able to easily fell their ribs. The ribs shouldn't be protruding so that you can see them (or could see them if the fur were not so thick), but they should be easy to feel underneath a thin padding.

 

(2) I like to easily see their "waist" where the ribs end as you move toward the rear of the dog.

 

If you can't get (1) and (2), your dog needs to eat less.

 

Of course, your vet can easily tell you whether your dog is at a good weight.

 

More experienced dog people can now correct my errors.

 

charlie torre

[Shoofly]

Hey Charlie -

 

I'd agree about the 2 things.

BorderWolf - I have a big *big* working male and he tops out at 52-53 pounds. I've rarely seen a taller working dog than him so i'd guess 65 pounds is probably a good bit on the heavy side.

[Cheri McDonald]

When Rob was in a cast with a broken ankle, he packed on some pounds. Also in the winter when we are less active they seem to gain weight. Our vet said to simply back down on their meal portions. Dogs do just fine on less food for long periods of time, unlike cats. So...when we see a little more pudge than they need, we simply cut their portions in half for a few weeks.

[juliepoudrier]

Funny story, sort of related. I was at a trial this weekend and one of the spectators had her border collie with her. She was standing next to my chair with the dog and I petted the dog. Not a sign of a rib in sight (that is, I couldn't even *begin* to feel ribs when I ran my hands over this dog). In a very nice way, I said something like "Oh, you're a little chunky." The owner immediately responded that it was "all muscle" from swimming and chasing the cats. Funny, I didn't know dogs developed a lot of muscle around their middles. I guess all of mine are just lacking in that department. Anyway, after the "all muscle" comment I decided it wasn't worth saying any more about it.

 

And of course I have been accused by a barbie collie person of keeping my dogs too thin.

 

FWIW, Charlie's description is apt. That thin layer he's talking about is really thin. When viewed from the side or above, your dog should have an obvious tuck behind the rib cage. The most obvious sign of a dog that is too thin is a prominent spine (sight hounds excepted).

 

J.

[cgt]

Robin: Ok. 65 lbs is off the charts, then. Good. I learned something.

 

Julie: I know what you mean. Many pet owners have intimated what a cheap-S**T I am because my dogs are "so skinny".

 

I've only had Border Collies, and only in the last 6 years or so, so I don't really have a lot of dog smarts. Let me ask this. Do y'all* think that Border Collies tend to run a little skinny compared to many other breeds? There are always exceptions, of course, but if that is the case then a fat Border Collie is REALLY fat.

 

charlie torre

 

* "Y'all" - To make sure I communicate properly with the North Carolinians.

[Shoofly]

Charlie -

 

No, i think they're the same as other breeds. It's just once you get used to the lean and mean working dogs, the plump pets look *really* plump. You know what i mean -- go to a trial and walk through the crowd and you can pick out the clean, chunky pets from the scruffy skinny workers in a heartbeat. I don't mean to put down the pet dogs, it's just true that they tend to be heavier. To be fair, they also tend to be a heck of a lot cleaner than my dogs! Don't know what it is about rolling in that fresh spring grass-green manure but sheesh my dogs are nasty this time of year!

 

BorderWolf - i saw in another thread where you got your dog from a shelter i think. In that case, it's entirely possible your dog is mixed with another breed and is nice and fit at 65 pounds.

[SoloRiver]

There's a body condition system by Purina that I think is pretty useful for honestly assessing your dog's weight although it's geared toward pet dogs. A version of it is here:

 

http://www.placervillevet.com/canine%20body%20condition.htm

 

Most working Border Collies are around a 4 on this scale, which Purina considers "underweight." Fly is about a 4, and extremely muscular -- if she were human, she'd look like an Olympic gymnast. She has the metabolism of a hummingbird. The scale doesn't say anything about muscle, just how much fat a dog should be carrying. If Fly were this thin and had no muscle tone I would think she was not healthy.

 

Solo is around 5 on this scale. He gets loads of exercise (same amount as Fly) and doesn't eat much, but he's a much easier keeper than Fly is. People with pet dogs consider him extremely fit but I'd like him to be a bit trimmer -- however, I feel like it might not be entirely humane to feed a 22.5 inch tall dog less than a cup of food a day. He can be hard to assess because he's got a lot of coat and it doesn't lay flat, so he always looks fatter than he really is. Our agility trainer thought he was obese until she got her hands on him. Agility people tend to like their dogs just this side of emaciated.

 

I see a bunch of FAT Border Collies (really fat, not just fat for Border Collies) in the pet obedience classes at my dog training club and it makes me want to cry. I don't know what kind of effort one has to put in to make a dog with the kind of drive and need for activity that Border Collies have actually become fat. These dogs often also appear to be out of control and it's further evidence that they're getting essentially no stimulation or exercise outside of obedience class once a week. Some of the owners think their dogs get so much exercise because they leash walk them twice a day.

 

Unless the dog is extremely tall, my first guess would be that at 65 pounds, for a Border Collie, he's overweight.

[BorderWolf]

Well I am unsure but.. My doggie is only part border collie i believe. Hes either hybrid dog/wolf or part border collie & chow. What makes me come to the idea of "hybrid" dog is the size of his paws, the color of his eyes, his mentality and how he constantly howls at the sky. I am no expert and probably wrong though. seeing as you can only make that asumption using blood tests.

[libby-at-home]

hey even us pet owners can buy a chuck-it and get the dog running!! Sophie was feeling a little tubby so I cut back on her carbs, and feed her more protein.She acts like she is starving now, so I feel a little bad. But she has free access to quality kibble so I figure she maybe just got a little spoiled. She is 32 lbs and 19"

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

If he's one of those crosses he's likely to be in good shape just as he is. There's no objective scale however. A friend has a dog in awesome working shape that stays right around 72 pounds. Another has a big boy in perfect working trim that stays around 67 pounds. Both purebred.

 

As several have mentioned, just check for his ribs. If you can't find them with a light touch (accounting for his coat), hit the trail, and cut back the chow.

 

I also do a score on the pelvis to make sure my hard keepers aren't losing weight. Similiar to scoring a sheep - the shape of the hip structure should be evident to the touch without being able to hang on the point of the hip.

[Sue R]

Just an aside on how other folks view our lean dogs: I had my Celt, a nice 42 pounds, at a store with me the other day.

 

I overheard a couple of young men (in their 20's) discussing my dog. The one said, with great certainty, that "that dog has greyhound in him - look at his shape".

 

A moment later, the other young man asked, "What breed of dog is that?" You can imagine their faces when I replied, "He's a purebred Border Collie." A combination of blank stares and confusion, perhaps?

[Olivia]

My two just went for their annual vet visit and we use the same body condition score as the purina link. Griffin (my 19 month old male) scored a 2.5, he eats 5 cups of food a day, he just has a metabolism to die for. He is also pretty tall, around 21/22 inches I think and weighs 43 lbs. Carlie (4 year old female) scored a 3.5/4, she eats 2 cups of food a day, and would be a sausage on legs if I would let her. She is a little girl, around 18 inches, and weighs 28 lbs.

If they work really hard (or not) I adjust their food, giving more or less, depending on the occassion.

 

 

Olivia

[AK dog doc]

I agree with the "hourgalss shape when viewed from the top, tuck up from the chest to the waist when viewed from the side, feel ribs but not see them" description. I tell clients this (at least twice daily). EVERY adult dog EXCEPT a pregnant dog should have this shape. Some hourglasses (like an English bulldog's, for example) will have a wide hourglass, some (like hounds) will have a narrow one, but they should all be hourglasses.

 

As a BTW, Finn's father is 60#, lean. He's a tall dog, but also robustly built, with heavy bone and broad shoulders. But trust me that the dog is in no way overweight at that weight. He's just big. Thank God Finn's build is a compromise between that and his mother's... I was dreading having a 60# BC on my lap every night. One of Finn's brothers is over 60# and lean, reportedly, but I have not seen this dog, so I can't be sure that's an accurate report.