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We started our online Foundation class

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I posted a couple of months ago looking for suggestions for an agility foundation class and decided on The Shape Up Agility one. We have had our first class assignment and so far I like their concepts, we are working on verbal cues and turns. One of the reasons I did not want to do Sylvia Trkmans foundation class was Cik/cap and my inability to tell my left from my right! These guys only use one turning cue for the same reason! Dr Leslie Eide is also taking the class, as is the Dutch trainer we work online with, and occassionaly in person.

I don't think this is a course for a complete beginner, there is an an assumed level of knowledge, as an example one of the tasks is sending to the tunnel on a verbal command only, but there is no guidance on how to teach the tunnel.

Fenway is having lots of fun, Sylvia Trkmans puppy class was great, but he was ready to add some motion and speed to his training!

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So their verbal turning cue is based on where the handler is in relation to the turn? Inquiring minds want to know :-).

 

I suspect (and may well be wrong) it's that it just means 'go the other way/change directions', so it's not really have to remember left/right. For me the command isn't 'turn left/turn right' it's 'change lead legs to create a turn going the direction you're not going now'.

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So their verbal turning cue is based on where the handler is in relation to the turn? Inquiring minds want to know :-).

so far we are working on three turning cues:

one that is a wrap, where the cue is the same either side, the dog is turning towards the handler on a tight wing wrap.

Left and right spins, not sure where they are going to be used

And post turns on the flat.

All of which are being put on verbals, along with tunnel and down/sit, and racing to a toy.

 

 

I suspect (and may well be wrong) it's that it just means 'go the other way/change directions', so it's not really have to remember left/right. For me the command isn't 'turn left/turn right' it's 'change lead legs to create a turn going the direction you're not going now'.

That is the NADAC switch, I have never trained with an International handler who uses an equivalant turn, to achieve a similar result on course they use a rear cross cue on the flat.

 

I am planning on videoing our work at the end of our first 2 week session, and I will post our progress.

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I don't know international handlers, period, not personally. I do know that our switch is One Mind Dog's Tandem Turn. So make of that as you will.

 

Distance and some of the other applications are sometimes different, of course.

 

https://www.oneminddogs.com/article/tandem-turn-agility-handling-technique/?lang=en

 

I do use rears on the flat a lot. Not quite the same application, but yeah, it creates a side change and turn in the dog, too.

 

That said, I don't want to hijack! I'm glad things are going well with your new class and it sounds like it's going to be perfect for you.

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No hijacking going on, always like a good conversation, the OMD tandem turn is effectively a rear cross on the flat, my dog reads the movement really easily, in NADAC most of the really impressive use of Switch I have seen is used from a much further distance, especially for complicated gamblers courses, the tandem turn would not work in those situations. (Before moving I had been in Elite in agility and jumpers in NADAC).

The turn I was talking about is a tight wing wrap, which is where Sylvia Trkman uses her cik/cap not a change of direction like the tandem turn or a rear cross.

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I looked at the Shape Up class, liked what I saw, wanted to sign up, but it had already filled. Bummer. I am glad you are pleased with it.

 

Regarding cik/cap turns: from a comment Sylvia T posted online several years ago (I forget where.), for her dogs, cik and cap always mean wrap left or right regardless of handler position. For example, my dogs will turn tightly to the right if I am on their right, but I have not taught/proofed them to turn tightly right if I am on their left as they approach a jump.

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I looked at the Shape Up class, liked what I saw, wanted to sign up, but it had already filled. Bummer. I am glad you are pleased with it.

Regarding cik/cap turns: from a comment Sylvia T posted online several years ago (I forget where.), for her dogs, cik and cap always mean wrap left or right regardless of handler position. For example, my dogs will turn tightly to the right if I am on their right, but I have not taught/proofed them to turn tightly right if I am on their left as they approach a jump.

I am auditing, when I first looked the class there was space, when I decided which to do 10 hours later, the working spots where filled. As an auditor you can ask questions, and I am learning a lot from watching everyone's videos. If I continue with them I will try and get a working spot as my handling will be more critical, I figured for foundation a working spot is not so important as I have a good understanding of the concepts, what I wanted was a solid guide to follow, just like I did with Sylvia Ts puppy class.

 

What you say about Cik/cap is correct it is why I could never use them as it would be impossible for me to remember which I was supposed to use on course.

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OMD lost me at "You don't need verbal commands". Well I beg to differ - I do because I need to handle from a distance.

 

I'm easily confused and do get my equivalent of right and left wrong sometimes but I also give the wrong obstacle command. Quick thinking and spatial awareness are not my thing.

 

When I get it right it's definitely the relationship between the dog and obstacle that is important, not where I am.

 

Directionals for us just mean deviate from your path in that direction and take the obstacle I tell you. Hence wrong end of the tunnel may be Back (go left) followed immediately by Tunnel.

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Looks like verbals are making a come back in agility fashion circles, there was a period where people aspired to run quietly and just use motion, but now you are seeing top handlers using verbals, especially with turns coming out of running contacts. I have always struggled with verbals, I primarily use them to send away, and use his name to bring him close, running a big fast dog, running flat out and rembering what I am doing has always challenged me enough ;).

Teaching Fenway verbals from the beginning might make a difference, we will see how I get on! Having them should make a difference to my handling and make it easier to get to where I need to be, to be competitive. Fennway is growing into another big border collie, so looks like the short middle aged women is going to be running another big fast dog.

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Yes, I've attended seminars given by 2 well-known US handlers, both of whom use verbals, the rationale being none of us are getting any younger and in the case of a fast dog, the choices are to either use verbals or to slow the dog. One of these handlers is starting their young dog using Susan Garrett's system of very precise verbals--this handler says that as courses get more complex, a more precise system of verbals is needed.

 

I initially rejected using left and right fearing that I would get mixed up. However, I have found that using directionals improves my course memorization. I only use directional/verbals at key points or if I am hopelessly behind my very fast dog. I'm finding that I have a need for verbals for threadles and backsides for USDAA courses and will be developing these..

 

As with anything else, you just have to train yourself to use them.

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