Public perceptions of the breed

[JohnLloydJones]

Funny, but I consider all of my border collies, past and present, to be pretty normal dogs.

 

J.

So do I...

 

... but there is always the possibility that one's concept of normality might change after living with them for long enough.

[gcv-border]

The "New Normal"? Whatever it is, my border collies are an important part of the picture.

[Pam Wolf]

The kennel clubs and the online ads for BC's with "an OFF switch" have done much to change perceptions. After all working dogs are impossible to live with aren't they? (sarcasm). I take pride that the agility people around here think my dogs are low drive because when in public the dogs are expected to behave mannerly, not wild and crazy!

Had an obedience person playing with one of my dogs in the house-she thought the dog nice and calm. At one point I told the dog to 'chill' (my command for go lie down and calm down). This trainer said, oh she is fine, let us play. I said OK but beware what you ask! In about 30 seconds the dog had 'gone over the top' and was climbing on her head going for the toy. the trainer god a bit scared and I told her that was why I had told the dog to chill.

[Sekah]

I experienced something a few days ago that was called to mind by this thread. I put a call out to people on my Facebook for photos of dogs performing a specific trick. I had 20-30 replies with photo submissions, and two-thirds of what I received were featuring border collies.

 

My feed is full of sport/trick people, so it does skew heavily towards BCs, but the sheer number of dogs of a single breed being put forth was amusing to me.

 

They're the dog trainer's breed of choice for a reason.

[ShoresDog]

I do warn people away from border collies, although usually I don't say anything negative about the breed, but rather am inclined to tell people that it is not a breed to have unless you are really into having a dog and are seriously interested in doing things with your dog and spending a lot of time with him or her.

 

I think this is a really appropriate way to caution people who are considering getting a border collie. That and the warning that they WILL solve any boredom problems that arise!

[urge to herd]

That's pretty much how I phrase it, as well. It seems to work - makes people think about what they want in a dog, more than just looks.

 

Ruth and SuperGibbs

[mbc1963]

Before I got Buddy, I had read enough about BCs to know that I wasn't suited for one. Too active, too smart, too wily. I was actually frightened when I realized I had likely adopted a BC or at least a half-BC. (I kept denying it for weeks before I gave in.) But I definitely lucked out; he never chewed or destroyed anything in my house, and with a good walk in the woods every day, he could settle fine.

 

I'm at the point now where I think I assume another BC will be wired like Buddy. I've lost my fear of the breed, to the point of seeking it out on Petfinder. Which really might not be a good thing! I'm 10 years older now than I was back then.

[alligande]

 

I'm at the point now where I think I assume another BC will be wired like Buddy. I've lost my fear of the breed, to the point of seeking it out on Petfinder. Which really might not be a good thing! I'm 10 years older now than I was back then.

You are going to be fine with your next border collie, we are on number 3, and had numerous fosters and I think they get easier with each one. You already have an idea what you are getting into, as like us the first time you did not realize what you had brought home! I know you are going to be a great home.

[Sue R]

What is this "normal" people speak of?

[CptJack]

What is this "normal" people speak of?

 

I could be wrong, but I think it might just be another word for 'kind of boring'.

[SS Cressa]

I think "normal" is the elusive thing that affects everyone else but never your own be it family, friends, pets, breed, job, etc...

[B Point]

There really isn't much perception actually. Most people are pretty ignorant. Those who do know that they are border collies most often say..."I've heard they require lots of exercise". That's about it really.

[simba]

'Collies are vicious [meaning border collies.] I've never met a collie who didn't bite. They are savage. I don't understand why people would have a dog who is going to bite people all the time.'

 

This was the one I heard most recently.

 

In fairness the person who said this had a point, in that the collies they have known have been vicious, with one exception which I reminded them of. This isn't 'oh he's nipping because he hasn't been trained and is trying to move you/overexcited.' Permanent-scar-inducing, 'don't go outside without a big stick or it will try to attack you' vicious.

 

I did try to persuade her that some people do have collies who won't constantly attack people and don't really need to be kept muzzled for the safety of everyone around them, but I don't think she was convinced.

 

Before I came on here I thought border collies were like pit bulls (or kerry blues or whatever)- in the way that pit bulls have a tendency towards dog aggression, border collies had a tendency to bite people. I was more wary if the person walking down the street had a collie rather than if they had something less scary like a rottweiler or a german shepherd or a pit bull or something.

 

It may have been a case of 'getting what you allow' for the owners of the savage dogs, especially since most of them were owned by one or two particular people who just keep having horribly human-aggressive collies.

[teresaserrano]

Here in Portugal there's no public perception of the breed, bc's are not common around here. When people ask what Tess is, I usually ask them if they saw the movie Babe, and say it's those dogs. But most people just stare blankly at me.

 

Tess is almost all white and fluffy so people tend to think she is cute. She was always quite friendly with people but she's aproaching 2 yo (in a month) and with maturity I can see she's having less patience. She dearly loves the people she knows well and likes and gets along well ith the rest of the world but recently she has snarled and showed teeth a couple of times to old ladies who buldozer to her talking shrily and think it's fine to manhandle her. I have no doubt she could bite in the right circumstances, although she has a great bite inibition and even in those circumstances it's pretty clear she's not after doing real damage.

 

I was always very carefull with her around people but used to let people who asked pet her. Now I'm just saying, Nope, she doesn't like strangers touching her. I think it's well within her rights to dislike that.

 

She's still overall a very friendly dog, but there's no point in putting her in situations where she might be uncomfortable.

 

My previous dog was both much less confident than Tess and more submissive. In her world it was unthinkable to put teeth on people's skin. Tess I can see could warn people by using her teeth without thinking twice if the situation was in her eyes serious enough, so it's up to me to not put her in such a situation. But I don't see her as agressive in the least, just as a dog that has a lower treshold than some of tolerance and patience to human pestering from strangers. She likes preliminaries.

[cwb3]

[Root Beer]

 

I'll readily admit that the first thing I tell people looking at BCs for SAR work is that you need to be a BC person first of all.

 

Coming to this late, but I think this is such a perfect point to make.

 

It is something that I will keep in mind to say in when discussing Border Collies as sport partners.

[GentleLake]

^^ Somehow I missed that comment, but yes, best statement ever. For SAR, sports, whatever.

[moosikins]

Sharing what I thought about BCs before getting our girl (it was one of the breeds that my husband and I said we would deliberately not get because we weren't prepared adequately based on our presumptions):

 

- hyperactive, needing TONS of exercise (Found this to be untrue as a generalization)

- extraordinarily intelligent (Quite true, actually)

- terrible with children (The defining reason we did not want a BC. Found this to be extremely untrue when properly socialized and appropriately supervised)

- stubborn, hard to train because of having a mind of their own (Found this to be also largely untrue. With good training, nearly anything is possible).

- not suitable house/family dog (Also very untrue of our mix, and of many I've met since).

 

Once we realized that Cal was part BC (it took a while for those paw spots to come in and the face to elongate enough for us to see the features clearly), we also realized that most of the things above were misconceptions!

[CptJack]

You know, there's one. Things I thought about BC based on casual interaction vs where Molly falls:

 

1-) Generally fearful - Not exactly. Molly is sometimes SPOOKY about odd things, but in general she's a really solid, confident, dog.

 

2-) Reactive - YEP. This is falling off with age, but she was BAD for a good 6 months.

 

3-) Not great with kids - Molly is absolutely not fond of kids. She's okay with school aged and teens, but little kids, in spite of having several in the family that she's seen frequently since being a puppy, just stress her out (I think it's the noise level and erratic movement). She will bark and avoid and I honestly have no doubt that if the issue were pressed she would nip. I don't force the issue.

 

4-) Obsessive - Molly isn't actually. Whether this is because I made effort to avoid this becoming an issue and don't allow things like balls and discs to be inside or she's just not, I don't know.

 

5-) Hyper/needs a ton of exercise - not at all true here.

 

6-) Smart - YEP.

 

7-) Athletic Yes.

 

8-) Toy drive - YES.

 

9-) Sight/sound sensitive: Yes.

 

10-) Not overly friendly/found of people: Yes/no. She's not any more into people she doesn't know that I expected, but she's WAY more into people she is comfortable with than I expected. By which I mean if she sees someone three times she wants to climb them and lick their face off.

 

So, basically, I think my view of them was not too far off true, at least as compared to how Molly turned out.

 

The biggest shift was that I found I didn't mind the things I expected to mind, nearly as much as I thought I would. Or at all. I expected lots of things to be a big deal and having her to be major work all the time, but that hasn't proven true. She's a really easy dog for us to live with.

[kcooper]

I've always found it odd that folks whom have never actually owned a BC, have the strongest "opinion" on the breed. I recall in the first months of getting my current collie, we visited many pet stores, parks, etc. Just general puppy socialization. I had numerous people flat out tell me that they're high strung, neurotic, ridiculously high energy dogs.

 

"Why would you choose that breed". "Good luck". "Do you know what you've signed up for". "There goes your free time" All sorts of borderline offensive statements. Oh. "But they're smart". I've had to meet this with an eye roll.

 

Yes. The breed has stereotypes. But as someone who has had bordercollies, past and present. I can't even compare my dogs. They were in fact the same breed. But every dog is distinctly their own.

 

Stereotypes are exactly that. Stereotypes. Meet my dog before you judge them. As I would apply to any dog. Any breed.

[mbc1963]

To be fair to the stereotypers, before I got Buddy I only knew what I'd read about BCs from reading literature put out by BC enthusiasts! And I was distinctly avoiding the breed, because of the stereotypes: will herd and nip children, incredibly intense energy needs, needs a job, will drive a normal working person crazy.

 

I understand the desire to not have BCs placed in unsuitable homes, especially after "Babe" and the sudden popularity of the breed, and the inevitable glut of ignorant people getting in over their heads. And I think those stereotypes are largely true when comparing BCs to... say... labradors. It's fair to teach the public what they should consider before getting a dog. But we can't blame the public for believing us when we "educate them" about the breed.

 

I was in the local shelter recently, and heard a worker explaining to a young guy that: "If your dog isn't doing well in your home, he's going to do less well in the shelter. Shelter environments are not good at all for herding breeds." I forgive young adults the mistakes they make; it's how we all learn important truths. I'm sure the guy picked up a cute puppy and was overwhelmed by the time and attention a young herding dog needed. After I left, I deeply regretted not hanging around to link the poor guy up with a local or regional herding dog rescue group, which could have probably fostered the dog while looking for a new home or at least courtesy-posted him.

[Alchemist]

I had to leave my dogs in a kennel recently to deal with some family health issues in another state. The woman who ran the kennel told me flat-out that she wasn't a fan of Border collies. Too neurotic. I told her that I was willing to bet good money that 90% of the Border collies she'd seen had come from a local mass breeder of "sporter" collies. She was stunned when she met my (working/working bred) dogs - totally different kettle of fish! I don't think I've made a complete convert of her (she IS a Dalmation person, after all), but she really took to my dogs (whereas she's always "full" when the sporter collie people call her).

 

I'm not saying it's all "nature". A lot, too, I firmly believe, is "nurture" - people getting Border collies because they're supposed to be "smart", yet it's their first ever dog. I always tell people that they're great dogs but not necessarily for beginners.

 

There sure are a lot of myths around about Border collies needing a ton of exercise (glancing at my three, imitating dead dogs in my office as I type). It's a shame, because it leads to a lot of puppies with ruined joints - people think they're being bad owners if they don't provide a ton of exercise for their pups.

 

I'm not trying to claim that Border collies are not without their quirks (and some of mine certainly possess such). But it's the quirks that make us all interesting, right? Two of mine are total love-bugs, and that includes children as well as adults.

 

I've had Border collies since I was a child, and I disagree with people who say they don't make good family pets - but that assumes that the family is willing to invest the effort in training it. Too many people own dogs and don't attempt even rudimentary training. That's especially hard on a dog as intelligent and as person-centric as a Border collie.

[Sue R]

Amen to that!