bcnewe2 Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 When I pass on I will have an outside wake and would like more dogs in attendance than people. I tend to like dogs more than people. If I wanted to be buried instead of cremated I would like a casket lined with say.....maybe a week of dog hair. That should be enough for a full lining. Thanks for the coldences, it's been a rough 6 months. Not looking to let up anytime soon. Thank God for the love of my sweet dogs, not to mention my parents dogs. They make these rough days bearable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaserrano Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 So sorry about your mum, Kirsten. Mumto4dogs, what's the difference between a smooth and a short hair? I understand the meaning of the two words but though when apllied to dog hair they meant basically the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Smooth would be where the hairs are short and lie flat. Short would be where there is some length in the hairs and the coat is thicker and lies flat for the most part. You could refer to smooth as short but short wouldn't be necessarily be smooth. Don't take my distinction as official though, it's just what is generally understood in my circles. I have known a dog with a shorter coat than my older one registered as medium. His coat was much shorter when young but it still conforms to the line of his body. I would agree with Maxi that Sammy above is medium. He has distinct feathering on his legs, a bushy tail and a bit of a ruff. But the clincher for me is type; his overall appearance is consistent with the expectation of a medium coat. It may well grow longer. On the other hand, my older collie is the type where the expectation would be a short coat. There are always going to be grey areas as to which description is appropriate for a particular dog and when registering there's a fair degree of guesswork assisted by experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon's girl Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 I know someone that has a "smooth" that the hair sticks straight out due to an overabundance of undercoat. There is nothing smooth about this dog except genetics. So, is this what you would call short? Although I've never heard that term used as an "official" coat type, it sure makes more sense to me than calling her dog smooth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maralynn Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Kolt is smooth in every way - short, dense hair. But he's got some seriously long hair on his belly. Like 4" at least. It's course and lies tight to his body. Kinda weird! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Kristen, I too am very sorry for your loss, and I hope that it will get easier for you soon. It will be nice when you can have just wonderful memories. And I love the idea of a fur lined casket! Yep, a weeks' worth would be about right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shetlander Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Kristen, I am so sorry for your loss. It sounds like your mother's dogs must have been a wonderful comfort to her. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teresaserrano Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Mum24dogs, thank you for the explanation. So my Tess would be a short/medium. Hair on body is between 2 and 3 inches long but very close to the body, it almost looks like she has really short hair, you can see all the muscles.. Legs and tail are feathered, also longer hair around her neck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CptJack Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 Kolt is smooth in every way - short, dense hair. But he's got some seriously long hair on his belly. Like 4" at least. It's course and lies tight to his body. Kinda weird! Molly's like this. She's growing a ruff and some longer hair along her back as her puppy coat sheds out but she's got long belly fur, and her TAIL fur is actually probably 3-4" long - but doesn't feather outward at all. It's really odd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 I know someone that has a "smooth" that the hair sticks straight out due to an overabundance of undercoat. There is nothing smooth about this dog except genetics. So, is this what you would call short? Although I've never heard that term used as an "official" coat type, it sure makes more sense to me than calling her dog smooth. I don't want t claim any authority for my personal distinction but it makes sense to me on a semantic basis not to call a dog "smooth" if its coat isn't smooth by any commonly understood definition of the word. My pup is registered as smooth but I think he'll end up like my other collie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon's girl Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 I wouldn't want to be in the position of authority either, but it is nice to have other ways of describing the many varied coats of BCs. Rough vs. Smooth is sometimes quite inadequate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 So, mum24dog, in reading anything from the UK and Ireland, I often see dogs referred to as "bare-skinned" - am I correct in assuming that means what you'd call "smooth" or "short"? The expression always makes me think of dogs running around naked! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 12, 2014 Report Share Posted December 12, 2014 So, mum24dog, in reading anything from the UK and Ireland, I often see dogs referred to as "bare-skinned" - am I correct in assuming that means what you'd call "smooth" or "short"? The expression always makes me think of dogs running around naked! I don't know, I don't think I've heard that description. Maybe Maxi knows. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxi Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Bare skinned is used by shepherds/farmers to describe those very short haired BCs (the ones with a coat almost as short as a greyhound or similar). ETA. I think it is more of a colloquial expression rather than a formal description that would be recorded on a dog's registration papers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I don't recall ever seeing a Border Collie with a coat that short and slick. Interesting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxi Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 I don't recall ever seeing a Border Collie with a coat that short and slick. Interesting! I've known a couple of registered dogs like this (belonging to another...though I don't think they were related to each other). They were both nice talented dogs and both a bit 'whippet like' in body shape.. So maybe that was somewhere in their distant pedigree. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Bare skinned is used by shepherds/farmers to describe those very short haired BCs (the ones with a coat almost as short as a greyhound or similar). ETA. I think it is more of a colloquial expression rather than a formal description that would be recorded on a dog's registration papers. That's what comes to mind when someone says smooth, even though I know they are probably referring to a coat that is somewhat longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxi Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Yes.. I think some call them smooth, but as you say..there is a range of coat length associated with this.. I don't know if all of them would be considered 'bare-skinned'..no doubt it depends on who you are talking to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz P Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Sue, some of the western cattle dog breeders like the super short, single coated smoothies. In the USA they call them "slick coated." I've know a few. Not desirable in my books. Genetically, there are smooth coats and rough coats. Smooth coats can range from slick/bare skinned to fairly plush almost GSD like coats. With smoothies, it's almost more of a texture difference than a length difference, though they never have long feathering on their legs. Some have a few inches of feathers on their tail. Their guard hairs are stiffer than those of rough coats. Rough coats range from dogs with wispy, sparse fur that almost look smooth coated (feathering and texture gives them away) all the way to insanely fluffy, long and thick coats that would be horrible in country with lots of burrs and seed heads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Good descriptions Liz. I still have an inbuilt reluctance to accept smooth as a description of a coat type that isn't necessarily smooth and it's just confusing that the short coated version of Lassie is a Smooth Collie. When it comes to medium coated dogs, I see them as being at the shorter end of rough rather than long smooths, although some people consider the latter also to be medium and register them as such. Maybe the people who do that don't understand the basic differences you mention. I can't find any guidelines on the ISDS web site but it's not the most accessible of sites. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 My Lark would have been considered bare skinned. Until she had a litter of puppies at age 7, her coat was slick, she had no undercoat, and she got cold very easily (much like a greyhound). After puppies, her coat thickened up somewhat and I would no longer consider her bare skinned. Her daughters are also pretty slick, although maybe not quite as slick as Lark was at that age. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liz P Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Smooth vs rough is much easier to show someone than explain to them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maxi Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Good descriptions Liz. When it comes to medium coated dogs, I see them as being at the shorter end of rough rather than long smooths, although some people consider the latter also to be medium and register them as such. Maybe the people who do that don't understand the basic differences you mention. I can't find any guidelines on the ISDS web site but it's not the most accessible of sites. For ISDS registration, I think most breeders fill out the forms describing the pups' appearance in the litters at about 8 weeks (when they sell the pups). We all know how this can change as the dog grows up...at least the ISDS now insist that a microchip number is included.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mum24dog Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Smooth vs rough is much easier to show someone than explain to them. Agreed. Throughout this thread I've been thinking that I know it when I see it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smalahundur Posted December 13, 2014 Report Share Posted December 13, 2014 Gláma, the dog in my avatar, that I would call "smooth" was registered in the Icelandic working dog register at around two years old as "hálfloðin". That translates as half rough...So they use this term for something between smooth and rough. (I hadn´t heard about it before I saw her entry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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