Raw Diets

[Shawnee]

Does anyone feed raw? I have heard that raw diets, especially no carb raw diets are good for dogs with health issues. My 10mth old BC started having seizures (grand mal) when he was 8 mths old. He was just started on Potassium Bromide. I have two other BC's from the same breeder, one being his sister from the same litter. Neither have ANY health issues and I am in constant contact with the breeder who has never had any dogs or dogs produced that had seizures. I have friends with dogs from this breeder with no health issues also. My vet is referring us to a neurologist so that we can find out why exactly this is happening. I have always fed my dogs Blue Buffalo and would like to hear what some of you have to say about the raw diets. I am currently reading Dr. Lew Olson's book: Raw and Natural Nutrition for Dogs. Just looking for opinions on raw diets.

Thanks,

Shawnee

[arf2184]

I've been feeding raw for almost 10 years. My dog told me to switch.

(Disclaimer: I was a teenager at the time, just figuring out that mom and dad didn't always know best, particularly when it came to the animals. I've since educated them. )

 

At around 8 years old, Lucy was stiff in her movements, smelled awful, had bad teeth, shed like crazy, and was sometimes constipated. She had always been a picky eater, but around this time we were having trouble getting her to eat at all. She quit eating dog food on several occasions. We'd change brands, she'd eat it for a couple weeks, then would barely touch it. She'd lost weight because of her eating habits and wasn't doing well. Mom, Dad, Grandma, the neighbors - they all said she was just old. I didn't think 8 was old so I kept trying. Finally she started improving...but she still wasn't eating her dog food.

 

A few days of observation revealed that she was using her dog food as bait...to catch quail...which she was happily eating (that explained all the piles of feathers scattered throughout the yard). I've never seen or heard of quail eating dog food before or since, but these ones did and Lucy was smart enough to use it to her advantage.

 

After that, I crammed a bunch of research on raw feeding (I thought it was crazy prior to Lucy showing me otherwise). It wasn't long before I switched all the dogs (4 of them) and started seeing improvements all around, particularly in Lucy who always ate her dinner, smelled much better and shed less for the last 6 years of her life.

 

I can't say that it will help your boys seizures, but I can say that my dogs do much better on raw and I will never feed kibble again. Feeding a raw diet takes some getting used to. I started out measuring everything and carefully portioning and also giving veggie slop, but I find the less I think about it the better they do. Just feed a variety, and don't forget to include organ meats. My dogs also eat vegetable pulp from the juicer. They love it and it doesn't hurt.

[chi chi pup]

Lew Olsons book is excellent,she is also moderator for Yahoo groups K-9 Nutrition. I have been feeding raw for 10yrs now and I wouldn't feed anything else. I did the veggie and fruit with the raw for awhile but have stopped that and switched to no carbs. My 12yr old border collie was having problems getting up, she has arthritis in her hips. After joining K-9 Nutrition I learned that dogs have no nutritional need for fruits and veggies and they can actually cause inflammation in the joints. Once I stopped the difference in her was amazing, she was getting up with no issues and was running around like she used to. I always thought that the fruits and veggies were good for them but she was proof that they really are not.

Dogs live longer on raw, their teeth are better their weight is good, energy levels are better. I had a doxie that passed away 4 monthes short of being 20, her body was still going but her mind was gone. Right now I have a border collie mix that will be 19 in December and she still gets around pretty good for her age. I would make the switch!! Cindi

[Smalahundur]

 

Dogs live longer on raw, their teeth are better their weight is good, energy levels are better.

No they don´t. There is no scientific basis for that statement, it´s all anecdotal.

There is nothing wrong with a good balanced raw diet, but there just is no prove whatsoever that it is better than good quality kibble.

[Rave]

I've also personally known two people whose dogs have had issues/gotten sick because of raw and had to switch back to kibble. It's not for every dog.

[Maralynn]

I would definitely give raw or at least a low carb diet a try. I don't think that there's a certain diet that is a magic bullet, but two of my dogs now have had chronic health issues clear up when they got on the right food for them.

 

My one dog did great on raw, my other dog doesn't handle straight raw very well but does great with a combination of a dehydrated food and raw. I use a grain free/low carb kibble as a back up food.

[juliepoudrier]

No they don´t. There is no scientific basis for that statement, it´s all anecdotal.

There is nothing wrong with a good balanced raw diet, but there just is no prove whatsoever that it is better than good quality kibble.

Agreed. It never ceases to amaze me how raw feeders will claim that raw does everything from curing cancer to being the canine version of the fountain of youth. I have nothing against raw--have fed it in the past and would feed it again (and my dogs do get occasional raw meals now). My border collies have all lived well past age 15 (old age for a border collie) on mostly kibble diets. Small breeds generally live longer, so one can't extrapolate the long life of a dachshund to what you'd achieve with a border collie.

 

I put my epi dog in a raw diet because her littermate seemed to have seizures related to eating kibble (of any sort; his owner thought that that the seizures might be related to preservatives used in the kibble). In my dog's case, raw, grain-free, or regular (including grains) kibble made no difference in the frequency or intensity of her seizures. It's worth a try, certainly, and it may help, especially if your dog's trigger(s) are related to what your dog eats. It can't hurt to try.

 

For people who say raw "cured" their picky eater, I can say I did not have that experience. Both of my picky eaters were/are picky on raw as well.

 

I know I've said this before, but I'll say it again. If you do research on raw meats found in grocery stores, you'll find that many are also contaminated with Salmonella (I think in one study 20% of chicken breasts in grocery stores had unacceptable levels of Salmonella). And when you're choosing to feed raw for the health benefits, consider the source of the raw meat you're getting. Confinement operations, routine dosing of antibiotics, feeding animals chicken litter (chicken shit and bedding, which happens to be high protein) are all common practices in the meat industry. I think twice about putting that stuff in my own system, let alone in my dogs....

 

I am NOT saying kibble is better, but you'd be wise to do your own research and consider information other than anecdotal evidence. When I feed raw, I try to feed my dogs things I have raised myself. I know not everyone has that luxury (and I certainly can't provide a wide variety of meats when I restrict myself this way), but I really don't have a lot of faith in the meat industry in this country.

 

Another argument used is that dogs = wolves and so should eat like wolves. But I contend that border collies as a breed were created by poor shepherds who certainly wouldn't have fed their dogs a largely meat-based diet. It's more likely that the border collie breed was developed on a largely grain-based diet (unless the dogs were catching it themselves). What this means is that as a breed the border collie may well be well-adpated to a grain-based diet. Again, I'm not saying you should feed a grain-based diet, but when making decisions about what to feed your dog, it makes sense to me to take many things into account, and that includes what your breed may have been developed on....

 

Just some thoughts on feeding.

 

P.S. There is also a belief that better control of blood sugar levels can help mitigate seizures. I am generally a once-a-day feeder, but for my epi dog, I started feeding her twice a day in order to keep her blood sugar levels more constant. You might want to join the K9 epilepsy group on Yahoo to ask questions and see what other folks have found to work. Unfortunately, it seems that seizures can be as individual as dogs and what works for one or several may not work for your own dog, but at least you'd be communicating/commiserating with folks who are dealing with the same issues you are.

 

J.

[chi chi pup]

I did not base my statements that dogs do better on raw based on scientific evidence, I based it on what it did for my dogs and their teeth did get cleaner, their weight is better, their energy is through the roof and I don't know many people that have had dogs live to be almost 20, doxie or not. My doxie had horrible skin, she was on a top quality kibble, I tried everything to get her skin under control but it wasn't until I switched her to totally raw that she had NO more skin issues. My almost 19yr old had routine bloodwork done last month, vet said it was like a young dogs bloodwork. To me that makes feeding raw good enough! My 12yr old border collie has NEVER had her teeth cleaned, the vet cannot belive how white they are, sure saved me from having to put her under to have her teeth cleaned like so many have to do. The same for my lab-mix and he is 10. People ask me all the time what I feed my dogs because of their muscle tone and coats and sure some of them look at me like I'm nuts when I tell them raw but it's worth it to me, it has saved me a ton of money on vet bills. It may not be for everyone, but I have heard nothing but good things from people who have switched to raw. Cindi

[juliepoudrier]

My dogs get raw meaty bones and have excellent teeth too. I am not against raw feeding (as I've said before), just against the proselytizing of "raw as panacea for all dog problems" that seems to run rampant among raw feeders, especially when the evidence is strictly anecdotal.

 

For every amazingly healthy raw-fed dog out there, I'm sure someone could point to an equally healthy kibble fed dog. At the Bluegrass Classic in Lexington, KY, this past week, I saw a bunch of beautiful dogs, fit, well-muscled, lovely coats and energy levels suitable for running a large trial course in hot weather on non-dog broke sheep. I'd be willing to bet that many of them are kibble fed, and I'd go a step further and say that some of them are likely fed non-premium kibble. My own kibble fed dogs worked for hours in the heat each day setting sheep. Fit, happy, healthy. And yet I wouldn't take any of those dogs as convincing evidence that a kibble-based diet is the best. thing. ever. Just sayin'.

 

J.

[Maralynn]

 

I know I've said this before, but I'll say it again. If you do research on raw meats found in grocery stores, you'll find that many are also contaminated with Salmonella (I think in one study 20% of chicken breasts in grocery stores had unacceptable levels of Salmonella). And when you're choosing to feed raw for the health benefits, consider the source of the raw meat you're getting. Confinement operations, routine dosing of antibiotics, feeding animals chicken litter (chicken shit and bedding, which happens to be high protein) are all common practices in the meat industry. I think twice about putting that stuff in my own system, let alone in my dogs....

 

 

On one hand I do understand this and kind of agree, but on the other hand its the stuff that's worse than that that is going into kibble. So you've got human grade raw meat or who knows what meat going into kibble. After the whole Diamond salmonella (which possibly affected a number of even premium brands) thing recently I've personally come to the conclusion that I feel it's six of one/half a dozen of the other when it come to which food that has the higher possibility of being contaminated.

[Ooky]

I did not base my statements that dogs do better on raw based on scientific evidence, I based it on what it did for my dogs and their teeth did get cleaner, their weight is better, their energy is through the roof and I don't know many people that have had dogs live to be almost 20, doxie or not. My doxie had horrible skin, she was on a top quality kibble, I tried everything to get her skin under control but it wasn't until I switched her to totally raw that she had NO more skin issues. My almost 19yr old had routine bloodwork done last month, vet said it was like a young dogs bloodwork. To me that makes feeding raw good enough! My 12yr old border collie has NEVER had her teeth cleaned, the vet cannot belive how white they are, sure saved me from having to put her under to have her teeth cleaned like so many have to do. The same for my lab-mix and he is 10. People ask me all the time what I feed my dogs because of their muscle tone and coats and sure some of them look at me like I'm nuts when I tell them raw but it's worth it to me, it has saved me a ton of money on vet bills. It may not be for everyone, but I have heard nothing but good things from people who have switched to raw. Cindi

 

Yes and I'm sure no one doubts your experience, but that's what Julie and Smalahundur are saying, is that all that is, is your experience and not scientific evidence. My experience with my dog is that while he very much enjoys raw, the more I give him, regardless of what type of meat or the quality, the worse his digestive issues become. I do still like to give him raw occassionally, both as a treat (he is not picky at all and he just LOVES it, like most other food) and as a good way to clean his teeth for a lazy owner like me. But pretty much every time I do it, I can expect some amount of intestinal distress from him. At first I thought it was just poultry, but now I don't even trust his go-to meats, lamb and beef, to not cause diarrhea or some combo of hard white bone-stool constipation followed by diarrhea. Obviously he is healthier if I can avoid this type of upset, no matter how nutritionally "healthy" raw is in an objective sense.

 

I also agree with Julie that I find the whole "it's how wolves" eat justification to be unsupported and basically an argument grounded in a logical fallacy. Dogs are not wolves. They have been evolving independantly for 10,000 years or more. Before even Border Collies or proto-BCs or even proto-collies of any kind were developed, dogs have been hanging out with humans, eating our waste scraps either by stealing these or from us offering said scraps freely. So in my mind the best "ancestral" diet, if this is the logic you want to stand on, should be meal scraps, probably a mix of both cooked and uncooked, highly varied, and definitely with carbs and grains in there as that's what humans tend to eat.

 

Here is an article I ran across about raw feeding looking at the actual arguments for it and the evidence or lack thereof, no special benefits have bene shown from it so far. To further drive home the point originally broight up by Julie:

 

the concept of “evolutionary nutrition” ignores the simple fact that taxonomy and phylogeny are not destiny, nor do they reliably predict the specific details of a species’ biology, including its nutritional needs. Sure, dogs are in the order Carnivora, but so are giant pandas, which are almost exclusively herbivorous. Functionally, dogs are omnivores or facultative carnivores, not obligate carnivores, and they are well-suited to an omnivorous diet regardless of their taxonomic classification or ancestry.

 

I have a toddler now, and between her meal leavings and stuff she drops, my dog enjoys about 1/2 a cup of meal scraps a day on top of his kibble. Some of these scraps I think are extremely healthy, some are not (cheerios etc.). I do try to keep him from getting stuff with onions in it, but even those slip by from time to time I'm sure. Rather than stressing this "junky" diet, I realized he is HELPING me by getting that stuff off the floor, and right now in my life as a working mom I am as glad to have that help as he is to give it, as long as his health and weight remains good, which both are actually GREAT. Although he gets a weird mix of stuff that is obviously all cooked for human consumption + a base of kibble, his health is actually tons better than when he was on a significant % of raw. Better coat, better digestive health and great stools which is saying something since we fought terrible daily diarrhea for over a year. Yet, another dog may have exactly the opposite results, and that's the important part - knowing your dog and his health problems, your budget for food, and your comfort level wrt what you want to feed.

[Maralynn]

 

I have a toddler now, and between her meal leavings and stuff she drops, my dog enjoys about 1/2 a cup of meal scraps a day on top of his kibble. Some of these scraps I think are extremely healthy, some are not (cheerios etc.). I do try to keep him from getting stuff with onions in it, but even those slip by from time to time I'm sure. Rather than stressing this "junky" diet, I realized he is HELPING me by getting that stuff off the floor, and right now in my life as a working mom I am as glad to have that help as he is to give it, as long as his health and weight remains good, which both are actually GREAT.

 

Toddlers - an endless source of food and balls (or at least that's how my dogs have come to look at them)

[Ooky]

Yep!! As an added bonus they are willing to play with the garden hose for HOURS...

[juliepoudrier]

Oh, and back to the OP's original question, there is some evidence that carbs during the post-ictal phase following a seizure (when many dogs are ravenous) are beneficial. The reasoning is that having come through a seizure is the equivalent of a human running a marathon, and this can cause a drop in blood sugar, which can lead to more seizures, so some quick carbs once the dog is past the actual seizure can be very helpful. At least one canine epilepsy site recommends feeding a small amount of carbs (a few tablespoons of vanilla ice cream) hourly after a seizure to keep blood sugar levels stable.

 

This same site also recommends a home-cooked diet, or if feeding kibble, finding one that is preservative/dye free. But, I just went back and read that you are using potassium bromide, so please read the note below.

 

NOTE: Since you are giving your dog KBr, you must be extremely careful when changing his diet. The sodium level must be kept constant, and changing the sodium level will change the absorption of the KBr. If this were my dog, I would make dietary changes only after consulting with a nutritionist to ensure that I wasn't inadevertantely upsetting the sodium balance in the diet and thereby possibly reducing the effectiveness of the KBr. This should be your overriding concern when deciding to switch diets for your dog because the last thing you want to do is set him up to have more seizures!

 

Switching to a raw diet will likely mean you'd have to add a source of sodium to the diet to match the levels in Blue Buffalo (or transition very slowly to give his body time to adjust). I didn't have to worry about that when I switched my epi dog to raw because she wasn't on medication at the time. She's now on phenobarbital, which doesn't have the same dietary restrictions. There have been numerous discussions on this on the K9 epilepsy list, but I haven't paid close attention because so far I haven't had to use KBr to control my dog's seizures, but I wanted to point it out, because sodium content should be a starting point for any dietary change you decide to make.

 

J.

[urge to herd]

One more anecdote that's anti-raw. I tried a raw diet with Shoshone, as one of a series of efforts to deal with her allergies. I used as a template something I can't remember the name of right now, it was all the rage 14 or 15 years ago. It balanced everything quite carefully, and I measured, mixed and stirred raw stuff plus some supplements for 3 months.

 

At the end of the 3 months, Shonie had lost weight to the point that I was worried about her. Her hips were sticking way out, her coat was dull, and she had very low energy. I asked a friend of mine who is very wise in doggy things what she thought, and she said, "Something's not right with this dog."

 

Switched her to California Naturals kibble, and in 2 or 3 weeks, she had put her weight back on, her coat was good again, and she was back to her normal, odd little self. She never stopped itching throughout the whole raw feeding thing.

 

Shonie, with her arthritis, allergies, and god knows what else, lived to be 15. Kibble worked for her just fine.

 

Ruth and Agent Gibbs

[simba]

I am NOT saying kibble is better, but you'd be wise to do your own research and consider information other than anecdotal evidence.

 

Another argument used is that dogs = wolves and so should eat like wolves. But I contend that border collies as a breed were created by poor shepherds who certainly wouldn't have fed their dogs a largely meat-based diet. It's more likely that the border collie breed was developed on a largely grain-based diet (unless the dogs were catching it themselves). What this means is that as a breed the border collie may well be well-adpated to a grain-based diet.

 

I read a bit of animal husbandry history, and the diets for sheepdogs were mostly oatmeal, supplemented with milk during heavy work. Black's veterinary dictionary recommended supplementing the traditional oatmeal-only diet with fishmeal.

 

The men who used dogs who I talked to mentioned bread, scraps (fat off meat and bits of vegetables), cheap kibble (varying quality), and potatoes/oatmeal. They also mentioned 15 as a young age for a dog to die of anything other than an accident.

 

Having given my anectdotes, I have to add the caveat that anectdotes and the opinion of experts are notoriously unreliable sources of information, especially when it comes to medicine and dietary interventions. Bloodletting was used by compassionate experts for thousands of years, because they saw the benefits with their own eyes. There's a reason we need clinical trials and experiments, and don't just go by common sense and what we've seen 'work'.

[juliepoudrier]

I just want to reiterate, in case the OP comes back and just skims or skips posts, that one must be very careful when changing the diet of an epileptic dog on KBr. Even if you think raw is the best diet for the dog, you need to consider the health/medication implications when changing the diet, no matter what you're switching to. I don't want this very important fact to be lost in the side discussion on the relative merits of a raw diet.

 

J.

[olivehill]

Another pro-kibble testimony here. I switched to raw several years ago and saw no improvements in our two farm dogs. Coat, teeth, breath, digestive system, etc all stayed the same. And this was raw with home-raised, antibiotic/hormone free, humanely raised and butchered meats so about as clean/good as it gets. Eventually I switched them back to kibble since with no notable benefits it wasn't worthwhile for me to put in the extra time and meat to continue. They transitioned back to kibble just fine and never experienced any issues. One is now a 65lb 10 year old, the other is about 120 lbs and 8. Both are going strong. And in the spirit of full disclosure, it's not even the expensive kibble.

[debp]

To OP. I have an epi dog, Blue. I, like you, want to do what is best in terms of the seizures. Diet is a big part, and for your dog kibble may be just fine. Keep track of the seizures to see if you can determine patterns and maybe eliminate things that lower the seizure threshold. Just quick notes to maybe help you in this journey.

I noticed a pattern of kibble and seizures. For example, after he got into the neighbors garage and ate a bag of catfood. Several seizures followed within the day. Switched from one brand kibble to another and seizures after each meal....

I had food allergy test done to keep those items out of his diet (pork, eggs, wheat etc.) Started raw diet and after a few mistakes (feeding too many fatty chicken backs resulted in pancreatitis) he has remained on raw for the last 4 years and has a beautiful coat, teeth and weight. Chicken, mackeral, veggies, fruit. Oatmeal almost every day - it is a "cooling" food. Honey and oatmeal after a seizure seems to cut down the post-ictal phase.

Bottom line is you will have to be very aware of what works and doesn't work for your dog. No one path is going to be laid out for you.

Sadly, my boy has been having more episodes the last year. A couple I can point to specifics and say...maybe it was the Cipro (known to lower threshold and vet should have known better!), or the Rosemary in the Salmon oil, or the Rabies shot he got last year.

BTW - my other 6 border collies eat mostly kibble and do fine on it. We add in raw goodies and raw meaty bones for their teeth.

[Sue R]

BTW - my other 6 border collies eat mostly kibble and do fine on it. We add in raw goodies and raw meaty bones for their teeth.

Sounds like you feed similarly to how I feed - I use a kibble that I feel is high-quality, supplementing (for teeth-cleaning) with a couple of chicken backs a week, and adding some raw meat/liver/fat from our own beef.

 

If I was in a location where there was a raw coop that suited me, I'd think about more raw *maybe*. Right now, it's all about the teeth and the enjoyment. And I like the kibble I feed, the dogs like it and do well on it.

 

Everyone's mileage varies, and you have to find what suits yourself and your individual dogs.

[Rave]

I get raw meaty bones from a vendor at local trials occasionally and all my dogs are fine on them except one. She can't even chew on it for a few minutes without causing significant GI upset. So she gets a boring old bone while the others chomp away on the meaty stuff.

[ChantalB]

I think the important thing to remember is all dogs are different, just like all people are different when it comes to feeding. Yes, we all have the same basic guidelines to follow but there isn't one set optimal diet for everyone. Know your dog, experiment (within educated reason of course) and keep a log of what works/doesn't.

[Shawnee]

Thanks for all the info. I did read through all the posts and there is a wealth of info there! Blue Buffalo has a grain free kibble, I think I will compare the ingredients to what he eats now. I feed all my dogs 2x a day and they get supplements in their morning dishes (diatomaceous earth and a digestive supplement) and a sliced banana. they love their banana

 

He has his seizures at the same time everymonth, no really he does (16-21 of the month) and he has about 3 each time (the first day he has 2 back to back and then will have one more within 2 days of the first seize). He has an appointment with a neurologist the end of June and we will see after that what we do etc.

 

I do give my dogs raw meaty bones at least once a month, and if I cook whole chicken I always let them have the raw organs from inside the chicken as a treat. My in-laws have been feeding raw for probably 17 years and swear by it, but they have poms and lab or lab-mix dogs, none have had health issues other than the occasional sporting injury (they do dock diving, flyball, agility, you name it and they even have a chiropracter for their dogs). I am interested in feeding raw, but my vet thinks it's bogus and when I go out of town I leave my boy at the vet in case there is a seizure issue so he has to be on kibble when he is there. I have someone stay at the house with the other dogs, he is a special case because of his seizures.

 

I won't switch to raw until I have enough info, from the vet, neurologist, and what I learn from people who feed raw or who have tried it. I appreciate everyone's input and I welcome more input from everyone.

thank you!

Shawnee

[juliepoudrier]

Shawnee,

My dog had seizures at the same time each month as well (just one grand mal), and I was keeping a diary of times, situations, etc. I had wondered about the ivermectin and flea/tick meds, but the seizures always happened a week after them, which I thought was too far apart to be significant. Then one month I was 5 days late giving the meds and she was five days late with her seizure. I stopped all of the meds, and she continued to seize monthly for the following three months. Then the pattern changed. Between January and May she had maybe two seizures, then none till I moved the following January. At that point she started seizing again, and eventually it got to be every 8-10 days. Not only did the seizures become more frequent but they became more typical (in the wee hours of the morning while sleeping, whereas before they always happened when she was racing with the pack down to the creek behind the house, which is pretty atypical). I could not find a cause/effect relationship (and really, other than change of location and thus the environmental changes that entailed, nothing I did to or for her had changed, though I went through a period where I gave her only bottled water since the water was different here). Finally in June I put her on phenobarbital. We are coming up on one year seizure free.

 

So anyway, if there's something that you do monthly that might correlate to his seizures, consider changing that thing and see if it makes a difference. If you have to board him periodically at the vet, would they feed your food if you packaged it for them? You could always go with some of the premade raw meals that would be easy for someone else to supply. Even if your vet doesn't agree with your feeding choices, he should be willing to feed what you choose if you supply it.

 

FWIW, the switch to raw did not make a difference for my dog, but Deb who posted here has my dog's littermate, and in his case it *did* make a difference. So there's no predicting. Just make sure you do it with the help of a vet or nutritionist so you can maintain the effectiveness of the KBr.

 

BTW, when Phoebe was having monthly seizures my vet told me that most people would consider that unacceptably often, especially if the dog is clustering when it does have a seisure episode. Has anyone talked to you about increasing the dose of KBr or adding phenobarbital or another anti-seizure med to try to lessen the episodes to something closer to once every three months?

 

I've read conflicting reports on whether repeated seizures actually set the brain up to allow even more seizures, but enough people believe this is the case that I think you might want to research and talk to the neurologist about what is an "acceptable" frequency of seizures.

 

My dog is crated whenever I'm gone from the house so I don't have to worry about the other dogs ganging up on her in the midst of a seizure should one happen while I'm gone. Generally when I travel she comes with me, or if I have to leave her, I leave her with someone I trust to be able to handle a seizure.

 

I wish you luck. Dealing with an epileptic dog can be challenging and heartbreaking (and also wonderful when you finally get things under control).

 

J.

[Shawnee]

Julie,

He was on diazepam (I know I didn't spell that correctly)as the vet and I were trying to treat him in case the events were isolated. I had not given him his heartworm preventative this past month when it happened (I was waiting on the order of inteceptor to come in, it came in after he seized). I still plan to have him and my other borders checked for the MDR1 gene anyway. He was started on KBr after this last episode, so he will be going in for blood work in a couple of weeks to check his levels. The vet and I both want to try and avoid PB if we can. My boy has a wonderful personality and neither of us want him to lose that in a drug induced stupor, I know some people whose dogs are on PB and the dogs are like zombies, if that has to happen then I will accept it, but I am going to do everything I can to try not to first. Patriot isn't like our other BC's who need "jobs", he is already a little goofy and believes he exists to be petted by people of any size (he LOVES to be held like he is an infant, all 45 lbs of him). He starts therapy dog training in July (when he is a year). Our trainer says he was born for therapy work.

The vet will do prepackaged food, I will be bagging up his food for individual feedings with his supplements while he is in boarding to make it easier on the techs, and they will just put a banana in his breakfast. When he goes 2x a week for daycare/observation I just make and take his food and they feed him there (he gets car sick if I feed him before we drive).

I have tried that VERVE dehydrated raw before, all the dogs loved it but it was watery and a couple of the dogs had trouble keeping it down.

I appreciate all the info from you and everyone else! I will post what I find out from the neurolgist when he goes next month.

Thank you!

Shawnee