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White Border Collies?[Photos Included]


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Well, my love of my life, Avy ( short for Avalanche), is what the topic states. When we found her on petfinder.com, she was listed as a white border collie,and we looked at her brothers and sisters, and they all most definitely looked like border collies. We've had her for one year, two months now, and I couldn't be happier. She's incredibly intelligent, loves me to death ( granted, she has separation anxiety..). The only thing is, as she grows, she still doesn't seem.. border collie-like.

 

She doesn't like going outside, she'd rather either sleep on my bed / watch TV ( It's just unheard of to disturb her while she's watching Disney Channel. If you do, she just rolls over and goes to sleep.), play with our 11 Year old sheltie and the 10 week old pup we have, or get on the rottweiler's lastnerve.

 

Well, back to the separation anxiety, she does not whine, she -howls-, like a wolf.

 

Which leads to my question -- Do you guys think my 'B/C' is a true Border?

 

I volunteered at a Border collie rescue for a bit, but all the dogs I worked with.. none seem like Avy. She's not lean, she's sheer heavy muscle. . the girl's built like a tank! She's taller than the average border height I've found.. my sheltie is 19" tall, and dear Avy's about 24-25".

 

The breeder told us she'd send papers, but we never recieved any.. This kind of confuses me aswell since Avy's only 1y,4m/o, so she's got tons of growing to do.

 

Anyone have any idea if she may be mixed? I've looked on the web and have found nothing about all-white borders.

 

Much love from Avy and I!

 

Thanks to my cousin's idea of Picture Phones, here's a few pictures of Avy. Sorry for the poor quality.

 

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Yes, white border collies can exist, though completely white BC's are not common. White patterned BC's (mostly white body with black patches or markings) are starting to be seen more and more, along with split-faces and the like, but I still wouldn't consider them common.

 

Regarding behavior...behavior isn't always a guarantee. You'll see dogs that are obviously NOT BC's herd like one, and you can find BC's that just have no herding instinct or have very low energy levels. Especially if her breeder wasn't high quality and wasn't breeding with herding instinct in mind. Some of the Barbie Collies (AKC BC's) have had most of their drive bred right out of them.

 

From the sounds of it, though, she is still playing with your other dogs, so has she maybe just not formed a strong bond with you? 24-25" isn't at all unheard of for BC height. My two are about 21", and one of my rescues that just left was at least a couple inches taller than both of them. And at almost 1.5 years old, she shouldn't be "growing" anymore...just maybe filling out some. Most BC's have finished their actual height and length growth by that age.

 

Of course pictures are never a guarantee, but in this case it would go a long way in being able to better judge (in my opinion).

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I think you'll find that Border Collies come in a variety of heights, colors and coats. I'm pretty new to the breed so I don't know what to say a pure white BC (no markings at all, not even ticking?), but I'm sure others here can comment on it. Just as your sheltie is oversized, Avy may be large for the breed. Her temperament sounds atypical but dogs are individuals and I've heard of laid back BC's though not very often. Maybe when you can post a couple of photos, people can give you more feedback.

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Yeah, she has no ticking or spotting what so ever, her paw pads are pink, eyes brown, and her nose is also pink, tough tinged slightly tan.

 

Her nails are clear aswell.. she's definitely not albino. It's even perplexed our Vet, but everyone loves the girl all the same. the 10 Week Sheltie pup, Dante', adores her to death. He cries if she's not around to play babysitter now .

 

Her coat's kind of funny aswell, she's reltively flat coated, but long, except for this strip from the nape of her neck, all the way to her butt that's curly as a sheep.

 

All the same, we love her to death ( even if she does have a passion for hording stuffed animals like a raccoon-- all of the other dogs get mad because she easily has 50+ critters in a 4'x6'pen.)

 

She adores me, really. She howls and cries when she can't be right next to her mommy. If she's more than 6ft. Away, she goes nuts unless she's distracted by the little one, or is too busy pouncing on the old girl's butt.

 

As for her growing, I was basing that on our Rottweiler didn't stop growing til he was about 3-4y/o, and our sheltie about 2.5y/o. If she doesn't grow more, that'll be a relief.. i have a feeling when she can be let out to roam the house like the old guys, I'm going to be sharing a bed.

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How did you find a breeder's sellable pup on petfinder? This is a site for rescues.

 

We had an all white BC for adoption named Katie:

 

BC52.5965664-1-x.jpg

BC52.5965664-2-x.jpg

 

She looks similar to your dog, though had no pigment around her eyes whatsoever. She is also completely deaf. She was reportedly a BC X Lab but I find this highly unlikely. She was the only pup in the litter that was white and the only one that was deaf.

 

As for whether yours is a "true" border collie, it's impossible to say. However, I see no reason why a border collie could not be all white. In fact, there is a good article on the subject found here:

 

White Border Collies

 

RDM

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Gotta love the white ones...

Talk about various sizes and colours...my 5 yr old bitch is saddle patterned.The three pups I kept ...traditional blk/white;white w/ blk on ears and blk spot on tailhead,w/ tan on a cheek and ticking becoming pronounced;split face,half black/half white with tan on a cheek...their sire was black and white...My older bitch is 52 lbs on a lean,long frame...the pups all in the low 40 lb range.

 

The first BC I ever had was a small 25 lbs...

Genetics in Border Collies are nothing short of fascinating.

 

 

Talk about variety! I found a cool website a while back,nothing but photos of Border Collies that clearly shows the variety (well of coat colours anyway).

 

www.colliecorner.com

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White BC's are definently becoming more normal. They are usually produced when 2 white factored BC's are crossed. Not something I would recommend. This is my Sneak as a pup... sneak2.jpg She is 100% normal and a typical BC, but her full brother and sister from another litter were deaf. Once this happened I naturally began researching these white BC's. The lack of pigment in the hair in their ears can make them deaf. So, now that I know what white factored looks like, I'll never cross 2 white factored dogs again. Sneak full grown waving at the camera... sneak4.jpg

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Originally posted by bc4pack:

Talk about variety! I found a cool website a while back,nothing but photos of Border Collies that clearly shows the variety (well of coat colours anyway).

 

www.colliecorner.com

I submited a photo of Ouzo last year to that website, as a split face (or "mismarked" ) example, and I now noticed they posted him as a White BC :rolleyes:

 

I guess he fooled the administrator in the same way he used to tease Sandra and give him the impression of a white dog His body is black, only his face is half and half (mostly white). LOL

 

Ohh, in regards to the ops dilema regarding the hight of Avy, my 14 months old boy is 23 inches high (well, he was a few months ago, he might have grown since, I need to measure him again)

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I agree w/ OkieJenna re:white factor breeding.

 

I was lucky.Rock was the only white pup of the litter and I did not go back far enough on sire's pedigree...it was his first litter and neither he nor his parents had white up past hocks except for average collars and tail tips,no white spots.

My bitches' parents were traditional blk/wht...but with her colour pattern, I assumed(correctly), she was white factored...

...so again, I lucked out...

It's a non-issue now with me since my females are all spayed.

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You would have been surprised how many people wanted the white pups. I had 7 in that litter and four of them were mostly white. Someone that bought one of my white pups was wanting to buy Sneak from me and breed her to a male that was almost white to have white pups. I told them what a bad idea it was and educated them on the occurance of deafness, and their response was, "Well they are so pretty!" Who cares about pretty?! Why would you knowingly make such a cross and know that you could be effecting a dog's quality of life? I still feel horrible about being so ignorant about it.

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Originally posted by Dal & Mad's Mom:

Possibly she is mixed with pyr. RDM's looks like what I'd expect of a bc body type.

I'm not quite sure what a PYR means, hehe.. Sorry!

 

I read the article on the white borders, and you know I'm starting to think maybe her breeding was a bit.. flunkie. I remember atleast three or four ( Out of the 8 ) were merles. They were mostly white with a bit of very diluted (Nearly white) merele on them -- most were what she called "Lilac" .. just very paled grey, and then one was red. Avy was a full white one, These pups were 400$, then she had a few normal ones -- all were black and white, two had half-white faces, the other was almost pure black -- These pups were 300$.

 

I wish I had the lady's contact.. kind of dawned on me that she might've bred wrong to get those 'exotic' colours for a higher profit.. What do you guys think?

 

Update on Avy, She's currently watching "Life is Ruff" on the Disney Channel while chewing on a rawhide bone. Her buddy, Shelby's also lying on my bed watching the movie aswell. I love my girls.

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You can't tell a white factored dog by looks. My Mick(he's my avaitor) is black with a white tux and some white on his paws. he's what I call a tar baby (all black on his face) he's a white factored dog. his littermate sister was white headed, 2 brothers had more white than black and one was a tri without any white.

If I hadn't seen his littermates or knew his background, I'd have never guessed he was white factored.

Regards

Kristen

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Originally posted by Dal & Mad's Mom:

I'm not sure why people would breed them to be white though as he has no respect in how hard it is to keep him clean.

I'm discovering that with my Zeb. We just got back from the dog park and he's filthy! He only looks clean for a few days at the most after a bath. :::sigh::: :rolleyes:
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PYR: Great Pyrennes. A large, white, heavy bodied livestock guardian dog. That would be my guess, too,

A

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Jenna

Mick's dam was black like him. Her Dam had lots of white but was a tri. You just can't tell by looking so that's why it's a another good reason to know the parents of what you?re buying and farther if you can. The first reason would be to see them work and be able to match the style of working dog that fits your tastes. If the dog is not going to be a working dog, it's still a good thing to know what your getting. a good working breeder can help match a dog to it's right owner.

 

I have a friend who was looking to breed her white factor dam to my Mick. When I told her about him being a white factor, I had to prove it to her by showing her pics of his littermates.

Besides Mick was neutered awhile ago for health reasons. so nothing to worry about with us.

 

BTW I agree that the OP's dog looks like it might have Pyr or some other LGD type dog mixed in. Not getting papers that you were promised is a red flag.

 

It's a challenge to keep my intact female working dogs away from my 1 intact LGD. He almost took a fence down trying to get to the female in heat. New fencing is already up and he's on the hurry up plan for neutering.

That is a scenario I can see happening to any person who is a shepherd/farmer with intact LGD's.

Not that it matters what the OP's dog is when it's obvious she loves her beautiful white dog. :rolleyes: But next time maybe a bit more research is called for.

Cheers

Kristen

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Don't be misled by demeanor or looks, the measure of the dog is whether or not it works. One of my dogs has curls, another has large bones and is very laid back, and my bitch is brindle ... they all work sheep and are all border collies. Bottom line is that you simply can't tell based on looks alone whether or not your dog is a border collie. If the breeder says she is a border collie, unless you have reason to believe otherwise, I'd assume she is and enjoy the fact that she doesn't look like "the rest :rolleyes:."

 

Kim

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