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There's a companion DVD to the book!?

 

Cool. I need to get that.

Not only that, there is a website with a gallery of photos illustrating some of the signals and tons of answers that Turid has provided to questions like the OP's.

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I agree with everyone else - your dog was giving off all the RIGHT signals - please don't take that away from her. She can only talk in dog language, and she is very good at that. Her body language- turning her head away, etc. all indicated to the Rottie that she wanted to disengage from the encounter and not interatct with it. When the Rottie refused, she had to step it up one notch - growl, etc to let the dog know to leave her alone. That is like us raising our voice and sounding more forceful if we tell someone to leave us alone and they won't.

 

On the second encounter when a scrap ensued, it was a direct result of the Rottie demonstrating what I call the obnoxious used car salesman attitude - "I will force myself on you and I have no respect for your wishes". Her snark would have been the equivalent of us pushing another person away from us, if they refused to listen to our request.

 

A really good article to read on this is Suzanne Clothier's "He Just Wants to Say Hi".

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Not only that, there is a website with a gallery of photos illustrating some of the signals and tons of answers that Turid has provided to questions like the OP's.

 

Thanks!

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Does no one think the triner has a problem? I do and would have said something to the manager. As soon as there was a problem I would have put the rot away.

A dog named Mensa? Is anyone here a memner of Mensa?

 

LOL! Do you know what "mensa" means in some spanish speaking countries? THICK IN THE HEAD!

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I agree with ALL of the above. None of my girls would have stood for that, and my grumpy old shepard (who is very clear on his body language and will tolerate a lot of crap but less so now that he's older) would have done the same thing, but probably sooner. They speak "dog" very well, and it's usually pretty clear when we get a foster who doesn't quite understand this.

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Could we go another step further and suggest she print out some of th excellent sites and have the OP take it to the trainer? Since she is an employee at the place of business, wouldn't it be to her advantage to educate the trainer? I don't think the dog needs to be re- subjected to the rude dog or continue training there, but for others sake, somebody ought to at least try to educate the trainer person!

 

Oh, I live with a genious, and I will say, from my non genious status, the highly intelligent ones tend to lack in common sense! (IMHO)

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so I let her know that Spirit can get a little "snarky" towards other dogs if they invade her space and won't leave her alone. (Please note, this is not a behavior I like, and I am working on it.) She has never HURT another dog before, she is just very clear, with stiff posture, turning her head away, a lip raise, growl or snap in the dog's direction,

 

 

I don't mean to dig up old skeleton's, but didn't you have a problem with a previous dog that was food possessive that you eventually rehomed after he bit you (Ghost)?

 

I'm not going to get into that situation, but if that was you, I'm a little concerned that you would lead Spirit into a situation like you did. Just the fact that your willing to do that, based on your story you could see it coming. It could be why Spirit is a snarky bitch to begin with, she can't trust you as leader. If your working on her snarky behaivor setting her up to fail in the situation you described is not the way to do it. If I am confusing you with someone else I appoligize, if not, please, for the sake of Spirit get some training instruction from a professional, not just somebody that hangs a shingle as a dog trainer, but someone that really understands dog behaivor and how the handler develops solid confident dogs as opposed to unsteady unreliable dogs.

 

This is not an attempt to flame or cause problems, just an attempt to not have a repeat performance.

 

Deb

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I do not cease to be amazed at the variety of people who hang up a shingle, and call themselves "dog trainers".

 

Amazing, Truly!

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Thanks for the replies all, that is pretty much what I thought as well. In fact I ripped up the card I was given as soon as I walked out, and talked to my boss about it 2 days later, stating that I didn't think this lady is qualified to be giving private lessons, or running a doggie daycare for that matter. She actually agrees with me, and has talked to her about Mensa several times already. Now that I said something to her, I think that Mensa at least won't be at the daycare anymore, and with some luck this lady won't be giving anymore private lessons. I never had any intentions of ever going back to her either, just to clarify.

 

Thanks for the links to the articles, I'll definitely go read those. I own Turid Rugaas's book and have read through it several times, very interesting read! I would love to get the DVD soon.

 

Debbie, yes I am Ghost's former owner, but that was a completely different situation and dog. Ghost was an extremely dominant, pushy, reactive, obsessive dog, and he was not the right dog for me. It also probably had a lot to do with the fact that he was not neutered at the time (He was very shortly after he bit me) as I was showing him in conformation. Spirit is a completely different dog, she is extremely submissive to people, and has no problems taking orders from me. She is on the NILIF way of life, and we are very active in activities including Canine Good Citizenship, agility and conformation handling (for socialization only). We will soon start up rally and obedience classes (obedience for the 3rd time, purely for socialization) in April, and I'm really trying hard to find a herding instructor near me, and plan to attend a 2 day clinic in May if I can get the money together soon enough. Spirit is not food aggressive at ALL, she has no problems with me taking away her (raw) food if I need to, and she sits or lays down politely (Though enthusiastically :rolleyes: ) outside the kitchen until I invite her in for dinner.

 

I did not deliberately set her up to fail, as you seem to be implying (I apologize if you are not). I had no idea what was in store for us, I didn't think that our lesson was going to involve other dogs at all actually. Yes, I should have walked away sooner, that is VERY true, and completely my fault. I'm not the most assertive with people in most situations and I should have told this wanna be trainer to shove it and left with my dog, that's certainly what I felt like doing the entire time.

 

If you or anyone else has any further questions about Ghost or that situation I would be more than happy to address them in PM.

 

Autumn

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I did not deliberately set her up to fail, as you seem to be implying (I apologize if you are not). I had no idea what was in store for us, I didn't think that our lesson was going to involve other dogs at all actually. Yes, I should have walked away sooner, that is VERY true, and completely my fault. I'm not the most assertive with people in most situations and I should have told this wanna be trainer to shove it and left with my dog, that's certainly what I felt like doing the entire time.

Autumn,

I think what Debbie was suggesting was that perhaps you could have taken Spirit out of that situation sooner. You seem to recognize that you should have put a stop to it sooner than you did, and I'm sure if something like that ever happens again, you'll be quicker to react. Just remember, you are your dog's best advocate and protector and don't worry so much about stepping on the other person's toes if it's in the best interests of Spirit (within reason of course).

 

As for Mensa, I feel sorry for her. It's not her fault that she's a big oaf who doesn't know how to interact properly with other dogs. Her owner has failed her in that regard.

 

J.

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As for Mensa, I feel sorry for her. It's not her fault that she's a big oaf who doesn't know how to interact properly with other dogs. Her owner has failed her in that regard.

 

That's exactly what I was thinking. Poor Mensa is out in the public with no directions as to how to act. She won't change till someone helps her or worst yet, a wise dog takes enough crap and puts her in her place to roughly. Mick in his mind doles out corrections to other dogs as he sees fit. It's something I always have to be on top of and keep a constant eye on. I would fear that this dog could bring out the worst in lots of dogs.

 

Wonder what Mensa's owner is thinking about now.

 

Hope your work finds a better trainer/daycare person, then you could bring back Spirit for training.

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I printed out that article (He Just Wants to Say Hi) and went over to the doggie daycare to give it to her, and since I also heard from my boss that this lady had been telling her that Spirit is aggressive, to tell her to stop telling people Spirit is aggressive when she certainly is not.

 

When I handed her the article and told her this, she completely denied telling my boss that, and even went so far as to say she NEVER called Spirit aggressive, as she doesn't label dogs like that!!! I confronted her on that right away, and told her she DID call Spirit aggressive TO MY FACE, and even went so far as to give me a number for a trainer that specializes in aggression, as she "Does not work with aggressive dogs." She denied calling Spirit aggressive again, and said that she simply had an "aggressive episode" and she didn't feel comfortable telling me how to correct that, which is why she gave me the number....... *HEADDESK* I told her that what Spirit did was NOT aggression in any way, shape, or form, that she was just pushed over the edge when Mensa did not read her VERY clear signals, at which point she says it was NOT Mensa that did this, but ZOEY? (Zoey is a LONG tailed rottie mix.) I said, No, it was most definitely not Zoey, it was Mensa, isn't Mensa the one that does SAR work, is a conformation champion, and uh, doesn't have a tail?? After which she looked confused and said she thought it was Zoey and I replied I was 100% certain that it was Mensa. *HEADDESK AGAIN*

 

At that point I told her that I hoped she found the article interesting and walked out.

 

:rolleyes:

 

Autumn

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Wow that lady is a bleepin idiot. Sounds like Mensa is a typical rude dog created by doggy daycare and/or dog parks. Ugh.

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