Starting a puppy

[RoseAmy]

Okay I guess I'll get us started off tapping into Carol great knowledge.

 

I have an 8 month old puppy just starting on sheep. Her father is a sucessful open dog known for having alot of power and presence. This is one tough little puppy. Been on sheep about 6 times now. she's been a bit of a surprise because from the first time she would easily circle both ways, will stop on balance (for 1 second) chance her flank with just a bit of pressure from me. A little step into her and she will stay back off her sheep. Will go and get them off the fence, sounds nice huh? Well all this is at the speed of sound..She shows nice balance BUT you have to keep moving, fast, Lie down is a distance memory when she's on sheep. (She has a line on her). Any suggestions for getting to slow down. At this point she will not hold the sheep to me. She has to be moving all the time. I realize she's young and don't want to put to much pressure on her. Any suggestions are appreciate by me and the sheep who are fast becoming exhausted.

 

 

RoseAmy

[Guest carol campion]

Hi

 

Without actually seeing your pup, my take on this puppy it is similar to many starting. I imagine that the fast really has a bit to do with tight even though you say she will bend out. She is probably not giving the sheep the room they need. But more importantly, she is probably not seeing you as enough a part of the picture for you to be able to help alter this.

 

Once I know a pup will work, my first goal, especially with a pup like this one, is to get the pup to follow my lead. In ones that are very keen, fast and reactive, the slightest movement from you or the sheep, cause a reaction in them and if the pup is taking you by surprise, not much you can do to settle things. You end up working for it—trying to keep up with the pup— rather than the pup working for you. As a result, you are never in the right place to get it to stop because, it flies off balance before you can build on that. And it is flying off balance because it is too close to really feel where to be and reacting to the movement of the sheep who are in turn panicking because the dog is tight and round and round and round........

 

Not uncommon.

 

You can put an actual stop command on her but at this age, that's a lot of pressure. You can though, do some exercises to encourage her to stop without an actual command and then you release her to flank (no command either) so you can subtly take control and dictate where she will go rather than her making lightening fast choices—flanking fast and tight—before you are ready.

 

If you can get the sheep to a fence, place yourself between her and the sheep—sheep behind you along the fence. You must work on laterally blocking her from the sheep so that she stops working them until you allow her to. Stay close to the sheep and don't go towards her unless she comes diving in. You may only get her to pause at first. You need to be able to second guess where she will go and move laterally to block her there. Don't let her flank on around between the fence and the sheep until YOU are ready. Block her til she relaxes and stops. If you don't allow her to flank around, then she will eventually give in and stop. Once she stops, you can say "stand" or "lie down" to mark it.

 

She will only stay put for a short time. You are not trying to enforce a long stop-just a moment to reflect that you are there and that the sheep are stopped and she needn't move. If she pauses or better yet stops a moment, next you can let her flank laterally a bit or you can step out of the way and actually open one side of the sheep up to her—encourage her to flank in that direction and cast all the way around. Again, you have no commands and you don't need them. This is just body language speaking and you dictating when she can cast/flank and when she is to not have the sheep.

 

She should be eager to flank in that open direction and when she does, step back out away from the sheep and follow her arc on around til you are back at the fence. Once there, slip into the original position again with the sheep behind you and you between her and the sheep. Laterally block her until she pauses and repeat this.

 

You want to be flicking her out as she passes the sheep when you release her. If you can flick her out as she passes from between the sheep and the fence into the open on this controlled flank, she will widen out as she reaches her original position across from the sheep and you. If you have stayed near the sheep, there will be room for her to walk up if she is ready for that and if she can feel it. If not, block her for now and pause her at that balance point.

 

After a few lateral flanks that do not allow her the sheep, and a few passes all the way around, she will relax and start looking to you to release her to the sheep with the next flank. You can then determine when she will flank so you can take charge of her movements rather than her flipping around on flanks unexpectedly or starting one way and changing abruptly before you can react. That abrupt changing is a perfect time for you or sheep to get knocked or gripped.

 

If you want to flick something towards her to keep her out as she flanks, remember not to put pressure directly on her-especially not at her tail. That will speed her up and make her frenzied to get out of there. As she flanks, flick something (hat—buggy whip—PVC piping—water bottle—fiberglass wand) into the space she is moving into rather than at her tail or face. Keep yourself following at her tail as she flanks and let the tool keep her head turned out. That way you can assure she will widen as she passes the sheep and fence and moves into the open.

 

This is important because this is where you can widen her without pushing her out. If she is wider as she comes into the open after the big flank, she will be able to look up and she should see the sheep back at the fence and you in between her and the sheep. Then you try to block and stop her-or pause her-so she can feel being there. Then repeat. Work on different lateral moves before you release her around.

 

You will find after a session or maybe a day or two of this, you can move the whole exercise in the open as you will have done two things:

 

1. Taken control and determining her next moves so you can think and help her and she can think rather than react

 

2. Widened her out so she can see you and the sheep better. The she can feel where to be and won't panic and tighten.

 

3. Helped her feel a balance point so she will start making contact and start walking up-though only a few steps, onto the stock.

 

In the beginnng, she won't be able to do this long. So don't ask for it for too long.

 

I do this with all my young pups along with other exercises. But this one proves helpful if when in the open, they just cast around with no feel yet for where to be to move the sheep. It is a good way to help them feel the balance point. Once accomplished, you can then start working them in the open asking them to walk up. They start working for you and start looking for a balance point. Without feeling a balance point, they won't be ready to walk onto sheep. Forcing them to at this age would be detrimental.

 

Let me know if you can picture this and if it makes sense.

 

Keep in mind at 8 months, it may just need some time too, to grow up.

 

Carol

[RoseAmy]

Carol thanks!

 

I know exactly what you mean by the fence work I had done that the first few times to show her how to get the sheep off the fence without busting them. And it did go exactly like you described. But for some reason I never thought of that to gain control.

 

Today I started her with fence work, and surprise the sheep realized I could keep puppy from eating them and settled down, which got puppy to settle down and puppy got thinking that I was involved in all of this. Even got her to walk in slowly a few times to swipe them of the fence.

 

I work her in a 200 ft. square paddock. If the sheep are in the middle she will work about 2 or 3 feet from the fence. right now I don't think she is ready for more room.

 

Thanks for the help and I'm sure I will be bugging you with more puppy questions.

[Guest carol campion]

Carol thanks!

 

I know exactly what you mean by the fence work I had done that the first few times to show her how to get the sheep off the fence without busting them. And it did go exactly like you described. But for some reason I never thought of that to gain control.

 

Today I started her with fence work, and surprise the sheep realized I could keep puppy from eating them and settled down, which got puppy to settle down and puppy got thinking that I was involved in all of this. Even got her to walk in slowly a few times to swipe them of the fence.

 

I work her in a 200 ft. square paddock. If the sheep are in the middle she will work about 2 or 3 feet from the fence. right now I don't think she is ready for more room.

 

Thanks for the help and I'm sure I will be bugging you with more puppy questions.

 

Perfect.