Krisztina Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Hello Beverly, I was wondering if you had any advice on squaring up my dogs flanks. What I'm doing now is holding the sheep up against a fence and flanking him around.I'm not doing too much of this but I'm finding it helps so he can't beat me around. I'm really pushing in to him to give me a clean flank. About half the time he gives me a few steps of ground. If he starts coming in again, I down him,and start over. I only let him proceed if he's going properly. I don't think it's the field size- we actually just moved in to a smaller enclosure-about 30 yds by 30 yds. We were used to working in a very large field and i moved into the smaller enclosure to give me a bit more control.Do you think it is not wise to proceed in this way? He's aan extremely tough 1 1/2 year old and very keen. Thanks a million! krisztina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambert Posted March 5, 2008 Report Share Posted March 5, 2008 Reading between the lines here I think that your main problem is not squaring your flanks but getting your dog relaxed and working his sheep. It sounds to me like he is trying to beat you around the sheep so he can slice his flank. I think working him up against the fence like this, while its easier to control (since you only have half of the circle around the flock to patrol) isn't really going to address the main problem. Also this sort of fence work with the sheep trapped tends to sort of wind up dogs and if he is uncomfortable at all with the sheep will increase his anxiety and desperation to get going. I'm afraid I also think your work area is pretty small but I'm not sure how desperate your boy is so maybe you need these tight quarters to keep a hold on him. However, I would be working on the stop and doing a little wearing in this tight area until I had control. Then I would get back out in a larger area before I did much more. I would suggest letting him drag a line and working in a bit larger area. The first thing you need to do is to get this guy to listen to you and stop quietly when told to. You should be able to stand in place and tell him to stop and he should (when you tell him if not the first time certainly the second). He needs to follow sheep quietly (wearing). Once he will do both of these things like a civilized dog you can start to move off balance and let him flank. When he does these flanks if he is not a goodly distance off his sheep then you need to step into him by coming around the sheep toward him using what ever command you use to back him off (I use "get out of that"). Its very hard to get a dog to square up his flanks if all he is thinking is "how am I going to get around this woman and get to these sheep". You need to do whatever it gets to have at least some of his attention on you all all times. Once he isn't just trying to beat you to the sheep he will begin to pay attention to what you are trying to tell him and he can begin to learn. If the above doesn't work I would hold on to one end of that line and do a little driving with him so you can control his approach to the stock. Once he is relaxed and working with you then you can widen those flanks out in a larger area where he has room to move right around the sheep and find the balance point. Hope I have read the situation correctly Beverly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krisztina Posted March 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 Beverly, It's really the amount of space that he gives the sheep that I'm having a time with.What I'm working on is his 'get out' - he gets tighter and tighter as we flank.We'll do some flanking and as we go on- I see first his ear,then his head,shoulder,turn in.When we're out in the pasture and I step in to him, he gets tighter.(probably my timing!).This was why we went into smaller enclosure,using the half circle.We have started to do a bit of driving with a light cord attached, a few steps is all I'm asking for now.We do alot of wearing and he's pretty steady.His stop is fairly reliable but I can see he's quite wound up. Thanks for your advice! krisztina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambert Posted March 6, 2008 Report Share Posted March 6, 2008 Its the relaxed which is the whole secret to the wide flank. If you can get him to relax he will flank out on your pressure, but as long as all he can think about is getting to the sheep he won't respond as you want. No magic formula here just needs a lot of walking around with you getting into his space when he crowds the sheep. If you keep telling him to lighten up and relax eventually he should do so. Beverly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lana Posted March 8, 2008 Report Share Posted March 8, 2008 Beverly, could you please explain how you like to use a long line. Thank you. Lana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lambert Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 I use a light weight of line (clothes line weight) and snap it to the dog's collar. If necessary I will hold the dog very tightly or I can let him range freely and just step on the line or pick it up when he is down to keep him at my side when I walk away from the sheep. The line allows me a bit more control and I find once the dog has been stopped a couple of times by my stepping on the line he is a bit more mindful of m presence on the field. Beverly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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