denice

Oh one little bottle lamb that isn't whacked try buying 20 to 40 of the little buggers in a couple months and raising them. That's wacked, but it was fun for awhile. Not sure i'd do it again. These are the biggies for bottle babies. While he is drinking milk don't feed him alfalfa. It is fine if you are supplementing a lamb that has a mom but alfalfa, bottle milk and an older bottle lamb spell trouble because he is very likely to bloat and die - not pretty. Also lots of C/D vaccinations to help prevent bloat - one vaccine every2 to 3 weeks at least until he is weaned, you can go every 2 weeks. Cold milk available for him to self feed is great but it has to be COLD or he will overeat and bloat. Bottle lambs come with a steep learning curve if you aren't careful and since you only have one we can't afford for you to 'learn' on this one. If his mom was vaccinated and he is healthy then you are off to a good start. Also watch for any coughing which is the first signs of pneumonia, not eating ect. I only fed my lambs three times a day for the first day or two then it was twice a day. I would put the milk in a plastic pop bottle and use a screw on pritchard nipple and they would drink as much of it as they wanted each feeding but never got more than a 18 oz bottle. they did have creep feed available and at 4 weeks I would begin decreasing the milk I allowed them. They would eat more creep then at 5 weeks they were fed 1/2 bottle one a day for a few days then just creep and hay. That 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 week old period is when to make sure you are decreasing the milk depending on how big he is and how much feed he is eating because this is when they usually bloat. Have fun with him, Denice

I have had quite a bit of experience taking care of dogs with this as a vet tech. Raising the food bowls or Hand feeding helps the dog can lie down and be comfortable while you are feeding them. Walking them with a bath towel under their belly so you can hold both ends for support and then a leash to guide them works pretty well. Mostly I have prednisone and supportive care used and most of them come out of it but it can take a couple weeks for some. good luck, Denice

Kylebrk, Hello I am located in Switzerland Co in the SE corner of IN. It is maybe a 3 hr drive from where you are. I would be more than happy to help out when I can. In the border collie herding world I am rather new to this haveing bc for 8 years but I am doing most of my own training and seeking help when I need suggestions. I have a 2 yr old that I have raised and trained and is ready to begin trialing so I am excited about him. I entered us in the Bluegrass this year so that will be a good challenge. As Mike mentioned I have held two clinics in the past 6 months. Patrick Shannahan was here in Oct and Jack Knox was here last weekend for a clinic. I am hoping to have Jack back again in June and then possibly hold another clinic in the fall. There are quite a few herding folks around Indy but mostly AKC/ ASCA herding trials and clinics. Like most things in life you have to have enough knowledge base to evaulate your options and pick the ones that suit you, your dog and your goals. Mike is a great source of knowledge and experience if you can get him cornered long enough :-) I have been trying to do that for quite some time. I have heard very good things about Judy and there are a few folks near Chicago also. If you would like to contact me please do so denice.r@lycos.com I will post any upcoming clinics on this site as well. Have fun with your pup. Get her coming everytime you call her and general good manners and respect and she will have a good base for stock work. If you go to Patricks web site he has several great articles there. Denice

I do have one opening in the Feb 14 - 15th clinic with Jack as well as audit spots. Jack will be able to give a few lessons Saturday after the clinic and may make arrangements for lessons on Friday afternoon if there is enough interest. If you would like to schedule lesson times please email me in the next day or two. I am 2 hours form Indianapolis and Lexington, 1 hr from Cincinnati. Thanks, Denice denice.r@lycos.com

Yes, this is a tough subject. Working as a vet tech for years I have helped many people and dogs in this situation and cried more times for dogs that I barely knew. I have held my own dogs in my arms for their last moments and always felt that at that moment as hard as it was there is no where else I could be. Some vets put in an IV cath fist. then use a soloution of basically heavy anesthetic that should take effect in minutes or less. Some vets are very good at injections in the vein and do not use the cath first. There are good and bad to both ways. I think if the vet is very good one injection of the drugs makes things quick and simple. If the vet is uncertain then go for the cath. The drugs stop the breathing and mental activity and then the heart. There can be involuntary muscle activity after death, urination, defication and what looks like 'gasping' which is disturbing to see but it is just muscle activity. Most of the time it all goes very smoothly but not always. Most vets will not allow anyone else access to these drugs due to the classification of these drugs since indeed they are lethal, even techs unless in the hospital. You may be able to ask the vet to come out to the car or ask ahead of time about them coming to the house. The house call would most likely have to be after hours. I would encourage you to discuss this with your vet now so that you are awre of policies and what to expect. I think helping our wonderful dogs end life peacefully is one of the greatest gifts we can give them. hope that helps, Denice

Tammy, I graduated from tech school in 91. I first had a BS in Biology so I only went to school for a tech for one year. I thought all the classes were super easy, esp after the Biology degree with Physics and Chemistry ect. I really think the secret is finding a super vet to work for. You have to look for one that not only uses the techs, willing to teach and train them but also thinks highly of them and will listen to their thoughts and input, one who will allow and encourage you to pursue your interests. I was super lucky and worked in a great progressive clinic for 8 yrs. I then moved moved west and to the country. They really used techs to hold the animals and clean. I was very unhappy working there and moved on quickly. School will only teach you the basics, the clinic you work in and the vets and other techs you work with after school is where you are able to develop your skills. I did not find I could support myself on a tech income. The hours are tough depending on the clinic. We carried pagers and did holiday and weekend treatments. Yes the rewards can be amazing and I learned a bunch and use those skills today. I recently began my own dog/cat grooming business making twice as much with setting my own schedule. I would also say hang out at a few clinics and see if you enjoy it. hope that helps, Denice

Bob & Amelia, Thank you for your suggestions. I haven't yet tried the gate exercise but I will. I did work on Bear bringing sheep out of the corner today and encouraging him a bunch so he would be 'less careful'. Bear has always been a rather easy going boy and enjoys calm and quiet. He gives me very dirty looks when I mess things up he needs to fix. I am also one that works calmly and quietly so I think we have been both rather 'happy' with everything going well. Bear picked up his directions quickly by me just putting words to his movement, he stands and stops well and his very much a team player. Today I worked hard on making things faster and more exciting, encouraging him to roll in and do whatever he wanted to make the sheep move and move now - no waiting and being a nice guy. He never got silly or out of control but he sure did move faster and enjoy himself. By the end of our session he was heeling the sheep even on the fetch!! I was Thrilled!! I have been encouraging him to push and heel a bit on the drive and have been able to get him to do that but I have never been able to get him to heel on the fetch. I was very happy to see him loosen up some and rolling into the sheep much more. Now I know it is in there and I just have to continue to encourage him more, help him gain confidence and figure out he/we still can have control and push at the same time. We will keep working on it. Thanks again, Denice

Bob and everyone, I would like your suggestions. I have a nearly 2 yr old bc that has been doing really well. He is a quiet dog, nice shapes, good feel, knows his directions, flanks nicely, inside ect. He does not like messes. He is a bit defensive, tends to hang back a bit esp. if he feels something is going to run and he 'waits' on the sheep a bit long. Driving and lifting he goes in at a nice pace but if he gets into their bubble before they move then his head comes up and he waits on them to move. He does not flank or turn off, he will walk in super slow motion. Once they move he comes on nicely. I do encourage and sshhh ect I would like him to roll on in nicely but haven't figured out how to get him to do that. I have moved around and gotten behind the sheep with him to help. Most of my sheep need a bit of a push. I try to mix things up and work him on different breeds and combinations so he develops the ability to read and move them all. When he is driving and I am walking 20 yards away from him but parallel I can encourage him to move up and push and he will heel occasionally just enough to get things a bit faster. How does bringing them off a fence increase confidence any more than not on a fence? Are you talking about setting the sheep right up against the fence so he has to squeeze up against the fence? I have tried some pack pen work with him. Thanks, Denice

I still have a few working spots available for the clinic. Normal temps for Feb are above 40 here. Perfect time to brush up on your skills before the trail season gets into full swing and get those outruns deep and lines straight.

I have been raising sheep for nearly 10 yrs now and I have never thought they were dumb. They come to the barn at dusk by themselves or bed down under a light or at least on a rise to see the surrounding pasture, they lamb and raise their lambs for the most part without my assistance, they avoid mud and rain and the hot sun in the summer. They can read a dog as well as the dog reads read them... I also see no problem in feeding the sheep in the round pen to be able to get them in the pen. My sheep know the difference between me walking amoung them to get a close look at everyone or catch one to treat it and feeding them. Granted when you are carrying a feed bucket they will gather around quickly. I would go into the round pen close the gate, dump the feed, then open the gate and rattle the bucket. I moved lots of sheep without a dog for a couple years, now I rarely go outside without a bc by my side. Even now there are times I will move a ewe with feed. Actually just tonight I was feeding hay and getting ready for our really cold weather when a ewe that is rather close to lambing walked into the barn with one other ewe and I saw the perfect opportunity to sort her off into a stall so I know she will be in where it is warm if she lambs. There was no good way to get a dog behind those two sheep so I had the dog lie by the barn door and grapped a grain bucket. Two minutes, no fuss, nice and quiet I had those 2 ewes closed in a stall. There are some good home study courses out there for sheep management. Univ of Minn - Pipestone has a really nice course as does Univ of Wy. There both are great for those who are just getting into sheep / lambing. Denice

I am pleased to let everyone know that Jack will be in SE Indiana for a 2 day clinic Feb 14 & 15th 2009. The number of working slots are being kept to a minimum so we can work each dog twice both days. I have sheep and places to work that will suit all levels. Jack needs no introduction to most of you. He is truly one of the 'Masters.' Lunch will be provided. Please Email me for more information denice.r@lycos.com

I thought I would chime in with a few suggestions. I began my own dog grooming business after working as a vet tech for years. I see lots of dogs with dry coats, especially this time of year. The dry coat and skin makes them itchy so they lick and chew more. Allergies usually are a possibility especially if the dog is licking and chewying on feet and front legs. It could be allergies but if she is inside quite a bit and licking now where she was not at other times durning the year it is quite possibly just dry skin. You might try fish oil capsules in her food. In addition to the oil and vit E there are great antioxidents in fish oil. Something with added vit E will help her skin a bunch. Brushing her will help bring the oil out of her skin and onto her coat. Also I know some folks that bring the dog in the bathroom when they take a shower so they can hang out in the steam. There are special moisturizing sprays and shampoos that most vets carry. I like the Hylite shampoo the best, my second favorite is Micro Pearls available only at vet offices. Both have sprays as well. I am letting out my secret weapon here but - Another spray I like even better is called "the Stuff" I buy the concentrate and add water put it in a spray bottle and use it after my baths on most of my groom dogs.( I don't use it on dogs with oily coats) It not only adds lanolin but helps with tangles and matts and is a dirt repellent also. I have used it on a dry dog also then rub it in, it smells nice. It will make your tile floor slick if it is sprayed directly on it. There are not many places that seem to carry it but I get mine through a mail order co. called UPCO. Hope that helps Denice

I just had a similar episode with my 5 yr old. He was just fine then came from the bedroom walking on 3 legs, holding up a rear leg. Then he would only limp or be 3 legged in the house especially after lying down - never outside. This went on for a week, I tryed Rimadyl but that didn't make any difference. Took him to one vet concerned about his knee. She said it was not his knee but the lameness continued only in the house for a month. I took him to another vet and she suspected some soft tissue damage but not a tear anywhere. I then put him on Duramax and broke the dosage into twice a day instead of just once a day. 5 days later no limp anytime and he is always wanting to outside to play or work. If your dog is walking with just a bit of toe touching or standing up on those toes it is usally a knee problem. All the best, Denice

Candace, I wish I could tell you read this book and it all will be great. Unfortunately herding and training seem to be life long pursuits. There are several good DVD's out which are nice because you can then 'see' how it is supposed to look. I personnally enjoy Derek Scrimgeous DVD's and newest book. I would try to find a trainer or mentor in your area. I really think that is the way to go because they can see so much that you will miss and they will have immediate answers for you. Good Luck, Denice

Emily, Here are just a few suggestions. I would ask what type of monitering system the vet office has for surgeries as well as the specific preanesthetic injection and inhalent anesthetic they use. Many offices will offer a pre anesthetic screen that will require blood work. This blook work checks the kidneys and liver - which is how the body gets rid of the drugs - to make sure they are functioning properly. Also some clinics routinely insert an IV for fluids during surgery which is always good and also gives them a direct line if the need it. Most of the current inhalent anesthetics are very safe but all vet clinics are not equal so ask lots of questions. Hope that helps Denice, Registered Vet tech

Just add to add my two cents. I have been a vet tech for 20 yrs but have expanded into dog grooming as well for the last couple years. I agree that the rake from Jeffers is wonderful!! It is inexpensive and works great. I like this one because of the two rows of teeth that float. I usually order several at a time since I tend to break mine about every 6 mo. I have used the Furminator and don't really like them. While they do get out a lot of hair they break the coat. I only use them occassionally on slick coated dogs. I also have a few brushed from Chris Christenson systems, a slicker type and a wooden pin brush - both wonderful but a bit $$. You can find them on line also. Denice

Where I am there are very few butcher facilitites that will butcher lamb so I have ended up taking the lambs myself and dropping them off giving the butcher the info on who to call about cutting ect. The butcher facility has a scale so they are weighted when I unload them. Hanging weight is usually 40 - 48% for lambs in my experience. I never ask less than 125.00, if folks want something smaller than "fat" it is still 125.00 because I have most of the expense in the lamb already. You also have to remember to adjust price according to feed costs ect and remember there are lots of folks out there that will pay a premium for home grown, organic ... You may be able to call your local butcher and ask how they charge if they sell 1/2 lamb or whole lamb to get a price per lb. Just my thoughts. Hope they helps

I also have some Corridale sheep. I wouldn't call them stupid I would call them heavy. They are not going to move for just any dog. They read the dog quickly and asses them then deciede if the dog means business and they have to move or if they can stand and ignore the dog. Each dogs approach to the sheep is different and I find a dog that comes in directly has much more effect than one that flanks. Many sheep read this as a weekness. I would a few different lighter sheep so your dog builds confidence then you can go back to adding in heavier sheep. Also I agree if someone has a more experienced dog that will continue to move into the sheep while they stand there the sheep will learn they need to move. But there again the sheep may move for that dog and know they don't have to with your young dog. You might try putting the sheep in an area they are not as comfortable or familiar in also, they may be more willing to move there. Good Luck

I have had some experience with both Pano and OCD. They can both be seen on xray. Pano usually comes and goes and often seen in one limb than the other where the dog will switch being lame. OCD is more progressive although I had a pup who would appear to be better briefly only to have the lameness reoccur in a short time. It is rather common to have OCD in both shoulders also and is more common in males than females. With good xrays and a good vet they can see the flatening spot on the shoulder or that the cartilege is a slightly different density indicating a spot where it is not formed correctly. In worse cases there will be a chip of cartilege loose in the joint space casing lots of pain. These dogs will have muscle attrify if things progress. I reccommend a ortho vet and possibly sending the radiographys to a vet radiologist. In my case the xrays were not conclusive and I opted to let the vet go in and take a look because I knew if it was OCD it would only get worse. There was loose cartilege and they scaped that off and he is super now. They was a period of only leash walking and crate rest which was tough on both of us. The first week he was sore, after about 5 weeks he was wanting to work again and has not limped since. The vet said no working for 6 mo but we didn't take that much time off. Keeping him quiet was one of the harder things. One thing the vet told me when I trying to decide about surgery was that we should treat the dog not the xray. So if the dog is continually lame there is something wrong and we need to fix it OR if the xray says OCD and the dog isn't ever lame then he wouldn't do surgery. Hope that helps. Denice, RVT

I have been a vet tech for nearly 20 years now and the leash pulling thing is universal. Of course add something that the dog would really enjoy getting to and no matter the size of the dog it is always a struggle to hold them back and get their attention. Not sure how well I can describe this without showing you but this is my no fail how to walk on a leash lesson. It is called "loose your dog." Basically you walk with your dog in the heel position on a loose 6ft lead. I walk with one hand holding the end of the leash and the hand next to the dog holding the leash about 3 ft from the dog. If the dog is not watching you or paying attention they will eventually get ahead or off to the side of you. You give them the lead to do thisby dropping the leash from your hand close to the dog, and holding the end of the leash with both hands now for the correction, and turn sharply with a pop of the leash - just a jerk and release- and go quickly the other way. So anytime the dog isn't paying attention you let him continue toward the end of the line a jerk and go the other way away from the dog. The dog thinks hey where is she going? she is not coming with me? If it done correctly the responce is nearly immediate and they will begin to watch you and pay attention to where you are going. You have to make the walk interesting though, lots of turns and stops and differnt pace so they learn they have to pay attention and not just walk straight from here to there. Of course prasie when they are paying attention. I then add a command that it is ok for them to be in front of me and do whatever as long as they are not pulling on the leash. Let me know how that works for you. I also have a great thing that works for jumping up on people. Denice, RVT

Colton's Mom, I am by far not the most experienced bc handler but I do have a couple super dogs, sheep and an close to you. You are sure welcome to contact me and we can arrange a time that maybe you and your folks could come out and I'd introduce you to "herding". I am also haveing a herding clinic Oct 24th - 26th at my place where there will be a trainer here - Patrick Shannahan - and folks with dogs of all ages and levels of training so you could see some of what is involved in the actual stages of training. I am located in SE Indiana, 45 min from Madison. My email is denice.r@lycos.com These folks are right a puppy is a lifelong commitment and the information you learn the better choice you are able to make. Hope I can help, Denice

I have 2 available working spots in Patricks upcoming clinic. Patrick will spend 3 days with us, his main focus will be helping each handler better train their dog and meet their goals. We will be working with mostly wool sheep, some of which are dog broke for the younger dogs. There are several different areas to work in depending on you and your dogs needs - from a round pen to an open large pasture. Each dog/handler team will be able to work approx. 20 minutes twice a day. The cost is 350.00 for the first dog, lunch is included in the price of the clinic. If you are interested please contact me for more information. Audit spots are also availalbe for 1 or all 3 days. denice.r@lycos.com I am located about 1 hr outside Cincinnati, OH