madvibes

Hi Bustopher, I think Petra said it well, but I just want to add that Bree is recovering nicely from her surgery! Dan / NEBCR, Inc.

if every border collie had an extra vertebrae, that would be a significant enough difference in morphology to classify them in their own subspecies. perhaps they should be, anyway! but i suspect if a dog has an 'extra' vertebrae, it's a defect. maybe not a bad one though?

Carol Campion is worth the drive. There's also Richard Seaman in Middleboro (down by plymouth)... i have never met him, fwiw. http://www.geocities.com/ltsuruda/SheepdogJunction.html

Remind me never to argue with Becca My impressions of Aussies are that they are barkier and jumpier than Border Collies, from an every day dog standpoint. From a working standpoint, I've only seen a couple of Aussies on sheep, and I definitely second the Scatter Method impression.

Same here! My Dune and our current foster dog Breck (who has never met a sheep) both perked up and were looking quite interested. Nice job with Jed, he looks like a great dog.

Please read some books on Positive dog training instead of taking advice from those who use aversives. The 'training' advice given on this board sometimes is seriously frightening. why would anybody want to use aversive training with their border collie? talk about completely ruining your trust and relationship with your dog. I agree with the previous response about Leslie McDevitt's book Control Unleashed. it's fantastic. here are some others: Pat Miller, "The Power of Positive Dog Training." Dr. Nicholas Dodman, "The Dog Who Loved Too Much," Karen Pryor, "Don’t Shoot the Dog: The New Art of Teaching and Training," Jean Donaldson, "Culture Clash," and "Dogs Are From Neptune." Dr. Ian Dunbar, "Dog Behavior: Pet Owner's Guide to a Happy, Healthy Pet," Dr. Patricia McConnell, (1.) "How to Be the Leader of the Pack, and Have YourDog Love You For It," (2.) "The Other End of the Leash"

One angle nobody has mentioned so far is nutrition. What are you feeding, and how much? It's possible that he just doesn't have a whole lot of energy because of a nutritional deficiency of some sort. Also, it's possible that after a while in your classes, he is becoming stressed, and has learned not to growl, lip raise, etc. I would keep an eye on his ears / eyes / posture, etc. and see how relaxed he is when he starts becoming lazy in class.

I also agree with Liz. Housetraining is not easy, as anybody with a puppy can tell you. Though Bella isn't a puppy, she's probably never had the structure that you desire, so it's almost like having a puppy... just hopefully one that can learn a bit faster, since the biology (ie. bigger bladder) should allow for that. Anyway, I would start with Dr. Ian Dunbar's book "Before and After Bringing Home Your Puppy". It is an excellent resource, and he's one of the most respected trainers out there. Use this as your doggie bible as you housetrain. Good luck!

no you're right. it wasn't meant as an attack, but more of a response to the OP's reply to what food she was feeding. I've been doing a lot of diet talking recently and sure i went a bit overboard, but it's something i'm passionate about these days and i won't apologize for that. And I agree with kelpiegirl that one must feed what the animal does well on. irritable bowel and allergies can develop even with great food because dogs do best with a varied protein source. feeding any food for 'years' is not necessarily a good idea, which is why most experts suggest switching foods every few months.

just because your vet says it's good doesn't mean it is... most vets get very little nutritional education and it's no coincidence that vet schools and practices have sponsorships from major dog food companies. politics aside, science diet is some of the worst food on the market. Brewers Rice, Corn Gluten Meal, Animal Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols and citric acid), Pork Meal, Dried Egg Product, Ground Whole Grain Corn, Chicken Liver Flavor, Oat Fiber, Potassium Chloride, L-Lysine. those are the first 10 ingredients in the sensitive stomach formula. ingredient lists go in order of most concentrated to least concentrated, right? so that means the first two ingredients are the most abundant in the whole food, and they're both fillers that are completely indigestible by dogs. (dogs do not digest grains, they are carnivores) then you get chemically altered fat. mmm fat. then some pork meal, which is the fist source of protein, way down at #4. dried egg 'product'.. what the hell is egg product? why not just eggs? then more nutritionally vacant corn. chicken liver FLAVOR, not liver... just flavor... oat fiber. more filler. more garbage. then KCl (an electrolyte salt) and L-Lysine, an amino acid. Really? your vet thinks this is the best thing to feed your dog? And people wonder why all of a sudden dogs have grain allergies these days. If you start feeding a good food (origen, evo... something grain free), the odours and bad hair will remedy themselves. bad coat and skin problems, digestion issues, huge craps, etc... are all a byproduct of terrible nutrition. --- Now as far as the baths go, you might want to start in a dry tub and treat like crazy for the dog's getting in there. then the next day, do the same thing. then the next day do the same thing. then the next day, dog goes into the dry tub and you treat like crazy when you just turn the water on slightly for a few seconds. repeat the next day. repeat the next day. then next the water stays on for 10 seconds with a little more force. treat like crazy. repeat the next day. repeat the next day. you get the picture. desensitize the dog to the water. eventually bathtime will be a fun party. be patient!

some dogs are grazers, some dogs aren't. not a big deal. 10-20 minutes is an eternity, IMO. 2 of our dogs average 10-20 seconds. You say you're feeding enough food, but I wonder if maybe it's too much? and since nobody else has asked, what brand are you feeding, and how much per serving?

if you go the booties route, Ruffwear stuff is great, but pricey: http://www.ruffwear.com/Products/dog_boots use Bag balm if feet get sensitive or cracked from the salt

sounds like a very typical female border collie to me guarding and establishing territory from another dog, while less than ideal, is understandable, guarding from you is unacceptable. I'm assuming she's spayed and he's neutered, so let's take typical hormones out of the equation....but... if you notice a serious change in temperament, you may consider having a thyroid panel done, as sudden shifts in behaviour are often attributed to low thyroid hormone levels. it could definitely just be adolescence, but keep an eye on it... if it gets worse, there might be a medical reason for it.

What might be a good idea is for you to volunteer with a rescue organization and foster border collies. We were always interested in the breed and decided to foster for NEBCR before we ever considered actually getting a border collie. I think it was a very wise move, because after a bunch of fosters, you know what characteristics you're looking for, what to avoid, what to expect, etc... it's like dating for a while before deciding to move in with a new person Border Collies really are amazing creatures, but put in the wrong situation they can be a nightmare, and good for you for considering that it might not be a good time. I wish more people thought that way. Good luck, and hopefully when things settle down, you'll make a great BC owner!