Jodi

Ok ... here's the latest. I got a private e-mail from "George." It basically said that he is not Cathy and mentioned how much he strongly objects to my lies on the board, etc., and shows how it proves what little I know about ISP addresses. Here's the funny part. It wasn't from George's e-mail address provided earlier in this thread. It was from tribluemerle@aol.com. For those of you who don't know her, that's Lesley (friend of Cathy's and Maggie's, and is also a member of the BCC list), who can be found at Merle Border Collie Yahoo Group. Lesley kicked me and several people off that list quite some time ago for expressing our views on breeding non-working dogs. Imagine that. Lesley, next time you have "George" e-mail me, at least remember to log out of your own e-mail and go into his. Oh, and change your IP address because it doesn't match the one Cathy and George are using. Cathy, please let it be known that no private e-mails from you or your cronies will be responded to. Like I said earlier, "Get a life." Lesley, I cannot believe you are stooping to this level. Nevermind. Yes, I can. And Maggie, thanks for watching my back like I watched yours when this thread first started. Good, quality friends you have there. Jodi

We have new members! Big shocker. Collieholic - Member # 5736, 03-03-2006 IsItGeorgeOrCathy - Member # 5735, 03-03-2006 hilcollies - Member # 5734, 03-03-2006 Jodi

Just copied this from the list of newest members. Hollins Farm (Member # 5728) junior member Registered: 03-03-2006 Farmer Swaledale, Yorkshire EweHerdMe (Member # 5729) junior member Registered: 03-03-2006 ewesherdme (Member # 5730) Member Registered: 03-03-2006 It's funny that a new member called "EweHerdMe" and one called "ewesherdme" both show up on the same day ... right after someone from Swaledale, (the very name "George" mentioned in this thread). Are you done yet, Cathy? It's truly pathetic. Jodi

Cathy, Get a life. Jodi

If it will delineate the dogs I own from the "GRIT" ("Golden Retrievers in Tuxedos")version, I'm fine with it. Jodi

Julie - If you look at the bottom of any one of your posts, you will see it says: "Logged: 143.229.41.254" That number is your IP address. It's like a computer fingerprint, in a way. Jodi

Blessedmom, Aren't you Samantha (hdk9) with the red tri pup that used to live in Nevada? Jodi

I just noticed something really strange. Cathy's IP address is: 195.93.21.33. George's IP address is ...... drum roll please: 195.93.21.33. How original. Jodi

I was bummed to see that Maggie cross-posted Mike's most recent message back to Cathy's list. A couple of other people there made comments about certain members of this group and this group as a whole ... that made Mike's comments seem rather mild in comparison. Maggie, I'm disappointed. Cathy, I'm not surprised. Eileen, you might want to lock or delete this thread. It's bound to go nowhere from here. Jodi

Here you go! Jodi

Eileen - In the deleted thread, did you post something about gathering ideas to take to the next meeting? I thought I saw something with a deadline date, but I was at work, and didn't have time to delve into it the way I wanted to. If you're still up for it, could you please re-post the offer? I really appreciate the time you take to discuss these issues, rehash things that need rehashing, and your devotion to the breed. I wish there were more directors that were active on this part of the board, as I feel it would be a good outlet for them to gather information, etc. Jodi

"What was said then? I remember something to the tune of "Why can't rules be set into place to prevent this and that?" and the reply was akin to "Because this and that breeder won't accept rules put on their breeding programs. Who are you to say so and so can't have x amount of litters?" You know ... I'm not angry either, but that's the way I understood it also ... and as a matter of fact, I posed a question asking if the "big hats" were breeding their females every heat from the time they were a year old to the time they are 10 or 11 years old, is this okay because of who they are, what they know, and how well they do in trials? In the time I stopped at the store and got home from work, the thread was deleted, and I never got to see an answer to it. I don't think it would be unreasonable to expect them to work within certain reasonable guidelines for the health of the dogs, and the breed as a whole. And if they are reputable, it probably would not even change their breeding program, considering the dogs are usually working too much to have time to stop and have litter after litter. What am I missing here? Jodi

Bummer. Why? What did I miss? Jodi

Oh how frustrating.

How is Swafford still getting away with selling ABCA registered pups? Jodi

Eileen, you're right. The "good reading material" was referring to the introduction to the boards. I lumped them together ... when they shouldn't have been. I was still reeling (and still am) from watching "Dealing Dogs." I know and you know we're not the "dark side." The conformation world feels that we are, though. And Maggie and I joke about it. Vicki, Rebecca ... great posts. Yes, Maggie can throw down with the best of them. I hope Maggie will stick around, and everyone will have a bit of patience with this one. She's not closed-minded and is willing to look at things from a different perspective. That's more than we can ask of a lot of people. Maggie wrote me privately to tell me about her experience the other day with taking a couple of her dogs herding, and told me that basically she will do whatever it takes to continue. So it seems to me that she's been bitten by "the bug." Good for you, Maggie! Jodi

Eileen - I didn't feel the comment about being circling sharks was all that far off the mark. There are comments such as "this might get good" and there are five posts about sitting down and eating popcorn and ice cream in preparation of "great reading material." I've "known" Maggie via the internet for a couple of years now, and believe me when I tell you, we've gone head to head over the issues that are being brought up here. But, we've become friends and gained a lot of respect for eachother. I think Maggie is on the verge of coming to the "dark side," or is much closer than most of the breed ring people I've talked to lately. At the very least, she has a lot of respect for the "working dog," unlike most conformation people who feel we own "coyote dogs" or "mangy mutts." Maggie, I wish you wouldn't leave, but believe me when I tell you, I'm not done with you yet! hee hee Jodi (p.s. - Sorry if this post doesn't make sense. I just got done watching "Dealing Dogs" ... the HBO special ... and I can tell you, we have far worse problem here in the States than people breeding for conformation. I am just plain sick to my stomach over what I saw of C.C. Baird and his entire operation ...)

Here's my two cents -- and that's probably all it's worth. This topic has come up over and over. And there are no real numbers for anyone to look at to compare the percentage of "working bred" (for lack of a better term) and "conformation bred" (same here) Border Collies showing up in rescue. Because I think the percentage of each is the real issue. Admittedly, there are bad breeders in both sectors. Right now, there is no doubt that there are far more "working bred" BCs in rescue due solely to the fact that the Border Collie has been around far longer than when it was recognized by the AKC. The question is ... how many people were really aware the Border Collie existed (or cared) prior to the AKC accepting it into their registry, and how much has it impacted, if at all, the number of rescues now showing up -- either working or show bred? Jodi

I posted a long message, and in it, I wrote: "the day that I see CH Bigboned Fluffybutt PT win the USBCHA National Finals, I'll gladly eat every one of my words." A response was posted that asked if I was suggesting that we cull the big-boned fluffy-butts - and mentioned that would include Herdman's Tommy's lines because Sheila Grew describes him in "Key Dogs" as being a rough coated dog that tended to be larger, with big, blocky head and much more white trim - collar, chest, foreleg, etc. Yeah. "CH Bigboned Fluffybutt PT." That's exactly how I would describe Tommy. Wouldn't you? And, Christine, I absolutely agree. It's great that the dogs have great homes with owners that dote on them and have them doing 20 different activities. I just wish they would leave the breeding to the people that prove the working ability of their dogs to a very high standard, and not have it be judged by what titles the AKC offers. And what's really sad is most of them think there's not much difference between an AKC trial and a USBCHA trial. Jodi

Laurie - Oh yeah, the ears. Your poor poor dog. I popped on to one of the websites of the people I was "chatting" with, and found a page -- with photos and step-by-step instructions -- on how to properly set puppy ears. It is truly a whole different world. I don't understand how they can quote these great late dogs, and not see the difference in what they have turned it into today. It seems so basic, so obvious ... to me. And they truly don't see it. Blows me away. I've run in AKC trials. I've seen the dogs that compete in them. Sure, there are a few people who have some nice dogs from good working lines that play there ... but they certainly don't put any weight into their accomplishments like the conformation crowd does. In standing around listening, you hear people talking about how "We've tried several times to get his HT, and if I could just get it, he would be eligible for his versatility award!" Tried several times? Tried to do what? Get him to chase sheep long enough for the judge to say he's interested? Jodi

Old Hemp ... Herdman's Tommy ... USBCHA/ABCA is just another venue for having fun, just like the AKC ... Thanks Julie! Jodi

Does anyone have the emoticon banging their head on the brick wall? I am not sure why ... but I've gotten myself in a "lovely conversation" with the people on the AKC Yahoo Group. I've been informed that the split is between the people ... not the dogs. Oh, and function follows form. "Dual Champion" "Award of Excellence" "Award of Merit" "Versatility Title" I give. My gag reflex can't stands no mo'. Jodi

No problem. I clicked on there and I can't read a word of it. LOL.

Thanks! The dog in the first photos is Zip. He's a 4 year old blue merle who has been such an incredible partner and teacher for me. He wasn't always dark, though. Most males tend to get darker with age. Here's a couple of pics of him as just a young pup. And Kiva (the pup) is going to be a fun one. I'm really excited about her, and can't wait till she's big enough to start working with me. Jodi

Thank you for all the information! I'll have to figure out what I'm going to do on a more permanent basis. But for now, Tony, I took your idea and made it much smaller. I took a 5 gallon bucket with the lid, put a big hole in the side of it, left a few inches at the bottom of the hole for a lip, and hung it on the fence with a few inches of mineral in it. No one's fighting over it or anything, so it seems to be working. I don't know how long it will last, though. And I'll need to put a "visor" on it to keep it dry when it rains. Again, thanks for the ideas and information. I'm sure we'll do something better for them as soon as the weather warms up a bit and projects start getting under way... Jodi