Parly

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-24839612 And again I've no idea what the process is for US but I'm still amazed this was able to happen to this poor kid. The dog had had six previous owners, and the last one had kept it for less than 24 hours before it attacked another dog, leaving him fearing for the safety of his children but he didn't want to pay a fee so lied and said it was a stray he'd found and then the dog warden would take it free It went to kennels and Mum said she had seen that it was not suitable for a home with toddlers but one of the staff said she had assessed them home and felt happy to let the dog to them and then £50 off it went. Everything failed everyone really other than the idiot that had the dog for 24hrs when it attacked another dog and he was worried about the kids but not worried enough about someone else's clearly he didn't give a shit where it went as long as he didn't have to pay. That people can just buy and sell and breed animals and we're still letting it happen in the UK is beyond me.

It is hard to get a true sort of overall picture to be honest and depending on where you are in the county and who is recording and then publishing information it can be hard work cos you do need to go digging and cross referencing info and then ruling stuff out it's a pain in the arse. Things do tend to come in waves and trends though. I live in a rural area with farms and sheepdogs and collies but Huskies are fast becoming the devil here. In five year three Huskies and a Spitz have been shot dead for attacking sheep within 20 miles. Another Spitz has been missing over a year which I suspect was killed over the hills sadly. Sorting through records and research BCR have done and found this old one they did with Battersea on kennel frustration which is interesting but some of those results are tragic. The number of dogs that ended up for biting children, chasing cars and the level of problems they had that results in them PTS is a bit soul destroying http://www.bordercollierescue.org/advice/Content/thedogshome.html

https://youtu.be/lQHRXa5Y0TM

The eldest had a thing for rolling on the most random stuff. Bits of paper or a tiny bit of popcorn or a mushroom or pea she found right behind the bin and pulled out to go and play with. When I'm shopping I'll have a quick glance to see what might have really high rollage value (lavender, fresh mint leaves and that sort of thing drives her nuts) Lemon. I bought a lemon, sliced and stuck it in a little pouch thing my God she was there a good hour.

Haha no worries!

I can reason it in my mind sort of standing with arms almost physically moving like you say to think of simple but I have appalling discalcuai (number dyslexia) and honestly it can take me so long to try and get tings worked out in my brain so it makes sense to me, I'd be there for half an hour it just isn't worth it. Would love to do agility though but again for the same reason I cannot get myself orientated and think on my fast like that. Too much going on in a small space gets me flustered and then I'm just a viral clip waiting to happen. I got disqualified from show-jumping years ago and was beeped. Started to leave but went the wrong way so tannoy guy shouted at me and oh my Lord. I'm a disgrace

See reply I just posted for D''Elle

Woo I didn't' even see all these posts until just now need to go back read them rest and then come back Just to touch on a few things whilst I am here though. This behaviour is found in many types of dogs, both pure-bred and mixes, and is simply bad behaviour often exhibited by puppies. You're right that many dogs in fact pretty much any dog will chase and nip and get overexcited Puppies are a pain in the arse actually. It can certainly be trained out probably more easily with a border collie than with most other dogs simply because they are biddable and learn fast. You surprise me here because it suggests you think chasing and herding even in BC's and sheepdogs is still a learned behaviour that they can be trained out of them? Is that what you meant I'm a bit baffled Just to clarify when it's specifically strong in BC's and dogs suited more towards being a worker it an instinctive behaviour - not a learned one. They don't learn it they are born with it built in and that means you can't get it back out. You can train them to learn how to better control it, develop better ability so they can manage it even better and generally do things do reduce the response to stuff that triggers them so they're not just "HOLY SHIT CAR TYRES WWAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!!" but you'll never switch off the thing that triggers it. Similarly if a BC doesn't have that natural instinct or interest for work you can't force what isn't there either - hence why we took Fleet. All blood lines of Border Collies originate from working stock. Even with careful, responsible, selective breeding it will take many, many generations for this instinct to be bred out. Parley, this statement is anathema to the people of this forum, and is precisely the opposite of the philosophy and knowledge of the people here. We are adamantly opposed to the "breeding out" of the carefully nurtured instincts of the working border collie. A truly responsible breeder of border collies is doing the opposite: only selecting for skill in stockwork. Please read the "Read This First" for more information about this. You really didn't look at anything on the website did you?! I won't get into who BCR are it's all on the website but just to be clear - they don't mean they actually want to try and get this out of them. It's more a cautionary word of warning as in “As a rule collies are likely to do because that's what we want from them as workers and actually bred into them. Even if we wanted to stop all this it would take as long to stop as it did to start so if you buy one of these as puppies, expect to end up with a full grown sheepdog sat in your living room and not a nice family pet. That's not what they were bred for and that's not where we want them to be. Go get a nice dumb golden retriever if you want a cuddly family pet this breed is not for you” The Border Collie has the worst record of all the breeds for attacking people. This is not true. I have not read the entire site but would not recommend taking anything they say as truth if they are making such statements as that. I don't mean to really take the piss but I read it like that and got a giggle on. Dunno it just sounded "Well I don't know what makes them say this and I haven't looked and read why they say this but it's not true at all and I know this because of reasons. Border collies / crosses are up top of the lists in terms of bites though. The world assumes it's the big bully breeds which they are top for fatal attacks. Collies don't do as much damage or case severe bites to make the headlines I guess. They are the top of the list for breeds responsible for bites in children under the age of 12yrs though There's other replies I need to read and will come back later when I've finished some work I'm doing. In the meantime I'll leave you with this just so you know we at BCR are the good guys honest . Tia (given a new name with her new home) broke my heart seeing her spinning and crying and whining because she did't want to keep spinning but couldn't help it cos it's all she has done for two years. She got a happy ending though but this is why I hate humans. We're vile really. OK gotta go but I'll be back shortly to take a beating if that's what's gonna happen - catch you later

Also re: Your trainer making it all look like a beautiful dance. That's one thing that fascinates and frustrates me in equal measures. A handler from border collie rescue just looks like she's turned herself into a nice fluid swirling and moving around with sheep it's like she just flat out showing off. Note the little dance into a big ball or swirling sheep around the 1.30 mark it's like she's doing performing arts training "OK moving outside then back inside graciously... swirling with the ball of sheep now... let's have the dog move here... now hold the sheep there again beautiful....and back into the swirly whirly ball of sheep"

You're not kidding it isn't easy but props to you for taking lessons! I'm fine with the commands and directions if we're both in the same position it's when we're facing one another and it reverses and I have to try and remember it's... OK right so my "Away" will be her "Come-by" Meanwhile dog has long since gone for fish and chips cos I could be there all day. Robin Dean is the the farmer we got Fleet from and I think he's won the international brace championships two or three times - brace being where they run two dogs at once. He has training kennels at his place too and there's a big whiteboard on the yard with name of each dog then a list of their commands underneath. I remember asking him "How the hell do you remember all this without wandering around with 286 bits of paper trying to keep up with each dog and who has what?" Funniest thing in the world when you hear the handlers giving all these weird whistles and noises for multiple dogs though. Sounds like R2D2 having a meltdown. Keep up with the lessons though I'd love to know how you get on

Found this clip of him bouncing and bounding around with a tennis ball the same day he learned the river is not a hard surface upon which he could run. He sprinted in behind our eldest dog then "dunk!" CHARLOTTE.... THAT GROUND HAS GONE CHARLOTTE!!!!" then panic swam in a few circles, got himself back to the riverbank where I was howling with laughter then ran up and down super fast with zoomies and decided that was ace fun so jumped a good 6ft straight into the middle of the river again. Oh bless him I cried laughing when he tried to run across the water and it didn't work out the way he'd expected.

How interesting. There's nothing wrong with it and I don't need to know because I'm concerned or anything he really is a happy little chap I just tend to sit and watch my dogs and horses generally and when something gets my attention I'll sit a bit longer and quietly watch thinking "Wonder what that's for?" Amazed how much I learned about one or two dogs just from doing that. Something so out of character would make me "Whoa what was that about? Not like her at all" then suddenly i'd hear the sound of a thousand pennies dropping "Ohhh.. No way I know why she does that thing!!!" Sad sometimes though I took a few years with one dog I never gave a thought to her behaviour until the day she did something totally different and made me wonder why. Jeeeez when I realised and things clicked into place I felt so bad for having not even noticed Still it's how we learn I guess.

I thought this too - figured it was something he'd started back on the farm but then realised he didn't have a single blanket or toy when he was in those kennels. Nothing. Actually when we met him he was so startled when I chucked a tennis ball he ran off tail between his legs "What the hell...What was that?" Just a concrete floor, handful of shavings, concrete water bowl and rats getting in through the front staling what little food he had. Sure it's just something he just finds comforting the same way kids have a favorite blanket, toy or label but it's so funny and bizarre watching him bounce his way around the house with a blanket in his mouth - legs out front and up high like he's marching to war but inevitably stepping on the blanket or t-shirt in his mouth and stumbling a bit then burying the tennis ball completely and pretending he's found it "Aha!! I finded you tennis ball take this!!! Rarrrr take that!!" He's a happy little soul though that's one thing. Went from this godawful kennel to almost unrestricted sprawling space - more often than not upside on the sofa with the other.

I need to come back and bounce off a few questions about agility I'm clueless and can't manage my way around an empty car park never mind anything else. Just looking at the KC judges guide was enough. I'd be "Tell you what.. I'll stand here in the middle and give the dog voice and hand signals to tell her which way to go how about that?" "Dog - this way!! Under!!! Hup hup hup!!!!" "Frame!!! Tunnel!!!! Over that!! The thing there the... THAT THERE!!! Poles!!!!" Otherwise I'm out.