Dinkle

Good luck David - He's very lucky to have such a great family who are prepared to keep trying and make things right. It will no doubt take a lot longer to cure the problem than it took for it to start but with patience and understanding I'm sure you'll get there. And at the end of it you will hopefully have a dog who trusts and respects you and you in turn will have a much stronger understanding and bond with him as a result. As you're rather a long way from Barbara Sykes...I'd still recommend reading her book 'Understanding and Handling Dog Aggression' - (it's available in e book edition too) even if you are working with another behaviourist - this will give you a great insight. It's beginning to look like I'm on commission from Barbara!! I'm not! but I do respect what she has achieved and what she continues to do for Border Collies... keep us posted!

Hi David I just wanted to offer my take on this and a suggestion (if applicable) - You say the problems started 4 months ago and that your puppy is 7 months old - so the problems started a few weeks after your new puppy joined the household (assuming you got her around 8 weeks old?) To me it would seem that your boy's problems are rooted in this. Your boy has been pestered and bothered by the pup and you've allowed her to do this (by the sound of it) to the point where he has lost all faith and trust in you. He's had to start assuming the leadership role in the house as he didn't see you as doing so. He even objects to you telling her off now as he sees it as his job! He's at an age, just approaching maturity, when he's very vulnerable to any changes in the pack dynamic. I had this happen when I lost my old girl who was very much an alpha female. My young male at 16 months was suddenly floundering - he became reactive to other dogs and people. It took me a while, I'm embarrassed to admit, to realise that he had picked up on my emotional state and didn't see me as strong enough, so with my old girl gone, he was taking the law into his own paws. Once I stepped up and proved to him that I was there to protect and lead, he became a different dog. Very different circumstances I know, but the result is the same - a young dog feeling let down and taking charge. I'm not going to attempt to try to advise you how to deal with this on your own, I'm no behaviourist! But I was wondering if (from your spelling) that you're in the UK? If so, please try to talk to Barbara Sykes at FOSTBC (Freedom of Spirit Trust for Border Collies). She has worked with many BCs with fear and aggression issues and I think she is the best person to help here. Best of luck, I hope so much that you manage to work this out Edited to add that: since my reply this morning, I've had chance to have a look through your previous posts - this has really been bothering me as I hate to see a young dog that people are recommending is best PTS because of fear issues. It would seem this issue has indeed been building since you introduced Millie, your younger dog. You've also been advised to try separating them and stopping her pestering him before. This bullet point from your post in November seems to answer quite a lot - and you yourself wondered at the time.... "What we did notice last night is that Millie was have a bark and snarl at him if he tried to get a toy, or come under the coffee table so he would back off and almost back himself into a corner and stay there. It seemed he was too afraid or too anxious to move as he was afraid of being snarled at again. I’m not sure if the above points are him lashing out because of this?" YES!!!! if you haven't already done so - stop her - separate them. Add this to the constant bothering him whilst he's trying to sleep etc and Kobe has been under serious stress. Your boy has been crying out for you to do something. A behaviourist feeding him treats once a week isn't EVER going to do anything to help him. You need to help him get his confidence in you back and you can start by removing the cause of stress from his life. I have a young pup and 3 older dogs - the pup is in her crate right now and the others have the run of the house. She comes out to play with supervision and is never allowed to persist in bothering my others. It's not their job to defend themselves or teach the pup manners; it's mine to ensure they don't have to

Then why did you write that I had come here with a question looking for help?....you got it badly wrong and don't even have the good grace to acknowledge this and apologise. Incidentally I never once came here looking for help - I only ever offered suggestions or support to other users and in doing so I never belittled or criticised the advice or suggestions of others.... I was the one insulted and yet you accuse me of insulting others. You are so far wide of the mark and seemingly entirely unwilling to even read the post properly. I'll leave you to your board now. I feel utterly disgusted by yours and GentleLakes' behaviour. You are both rude, arrogant and misinformed in your attitudes. Perhaps before you both criticise others, you could take a look at your own behaviour. Good evening to you - enjoy the rest of your weekend

Thank you, this is really nice of you and much appreciated. I'm sorry too if my response to you was a little snippy - it really wasn't you who got my back up and I do think the point you made is fair and correct.

Oh dear....perhaps go back and read the thread before jumping on me?...I am not the OP. I responded to the op with a perfectly nice training game that they may wish to try with their pup and because I DARED to use the word 'herding' in the title of my game I was taken to task...so in fact it was me who was trying to be helpful and someone else who took offense at my terminology that they deemed inappropriate and then insulted me by calling me uninformed and foolish...I'm afraid your response and speed to back up another 'senior member' without verifying your facts only reinforces the reasons why I stayed away from this board for so long. I am the one wishing that I had never tried to be helpful at this point.

Well, nearly right... I signed up to this board some years ago and was put off by attitudes then by some who clearly spend a lot of time on here and consider themselves authorities, so it has taken me a few years to return. I see some things never change. Regarding the remainder of your post - interesting to see your explanation, it's not entirely correct of course, but interesting nonetheless. Thank you for calling me foolish and uninformed (and whichever way I read that, it's what you intended), I am far from it but you were so busy being pedantic that you missed that.

thank you - but my collie enjoys the game immensely and hasn't once complained about the commands I use...and there is no intention or requirement for her ever to work stock. I'm bright enough to have figured out for myself that might have been confusing ;-)

Wow! talk about pedantic! I can call it herding the ball if I choose to do so and there is no harm in that whatsoever and I'm pretty damn sure that it hasn't ever confused anyone...well not anyone with a modicum of intelligence anyway. And no, I have no intention of my dogs ever working livestock - it's just a game which pet collies love . Some people...!

start at close quarters and lure the dog round the ball in the direction you want - repeat and add in the command, treat and praise. Then move a little further back and lure towards and round in the direction you want again (ie anticlockwise) for 'away'. bring the dog to the '12 o'clock' position to the ball each time before your treat/praise. From there after enough repetition you can start sending them out from a few feet from the ball with an arm movement similar to your lure with a treat alongside the command. As BCs they seem to get it really fast as its so hard wired into them! you can then increase the distance. Repeat for 'Come By' going clockwise towards the ball and moving to the 12 o'clock position. For 'walk up', you'll first need the pup to have a decent 'lie down' or 'stay' then you put them in a down/stay position and back away. Ask them or lure them towards you but almost immediately ask for another 'lie down' or 'stay' - after a while when they are moving slowly towards you, anticipating another 'stay' or 'lie down' you can start to add in the command for moving forwards eg 'walk up' and putting the ball in between the 2 of you. They then start to target the ball in the walk up if you always get them to stop/lie down on reaching the ball - again, easy for BCs, it's in their DNA :-) to crouch and stalk up. After a few sessions my girl was doing it with me about 10ft from the ball - she'd run out to it then lie down at the 12 o'clock . Amazing how many times she'll do this and how much entertainment she gets from a stationary ball!! To get more exercise just increase the distance to the ball You can place the ball, roll it or throw it depending on how much stimulation that particular dog needs to focus on it. it's great fun - give it a try and I hope you enjoy it!

couldn't agree more - great advice

How exciting! Look forward to seeing more pics as he grows up - he looks a cheeky little fella!

Ah I have one like that...she will happily eat any 'real' meat whether it's cooked or raw but any proprietary dog food kibble, canned or treats did nothing for her. Never did since she was 8 weeks old and she's now 3 and hasn't changed. As I don't have the storage space to feed raw to my dogs, they do get kibble and tinned meat - so the only way I have found to get her to show any interest in it is either with dog gravy or canned pumpkin (this is her favourite). She has always driven me to distraction with her stubbornness regarding food - my others wolf theirs down and she just stands and stares at hers! But I wouldn't worry too much - my Midge always maintained a good weight and had a super shiny coat, so clearly she was/is getting enough of what she needs even though it never did seem enough to me. So I would judge yours by condition. If he is a good weight, active and otherwise healthy, I wouldn't stress too much about the food ( but do try the pumpkin!)

I'd definitely second the recommendation for mental rather than physical exercise. When my 3 yr old BC was a pup, physical exercise left her really hyped, unable to settle and much more likely to nip me and bother my other dogs even when she was physically exhausted. So I taught her to herd a tennis ball. She had great working instincts and loved it! I taught her 'come by', 'away to me', 'walk up', lie down, 'that'll do' and various others that harnessed her natural instincts. The most I would ever do with the ball was gently roll it away from us 10-15 ft with her by my side, then I would send her out to it with an 'away' then have her lie down then call her back with a 'that'll do'...then back out to the ball in the other direction with a 'come by'. I'd have her stalk up to it with 'walk up' and get her to lie down occasionally as she did so. Her ultimate reward was once or twice I would tell her to 'go get it' and she was allowed to pick the ball up. It was very little real physical exercise but she was using her brain constantly and hanging on my every word and it left her tired and relaxed. I kept my voice barely above a whisper so that she really had to focus on me and I kept it really calm - we could then go home and she would put herself to bed. Just 5 or 10 minutes is plenty. Much better than playing 'fetch' with a tennis ball (which I hate as it is so hard on dogs joints)

What one person chooses to allow their dog to do and another doesn't is personal preference: so perhaps you could find a level of expectation that you are both happy with rather than it all being the way your boyfriend wants it. However to me, the relationship between dog and human should be based on trust and respect - I would neither trust nor respect someone who took my food away whilst I was eating and wouldn't expect any dog of mine to either! Honestly, his approach sounds rather strict to me and entirely based on dominating the pup. I'd go back to your way....it sounds much better.

Hello - I'm not too far from yourselves - over in the North Pennines. I've got a 7 yr old and 3 yr old BC and just brought home a 9 week old. Would recommend having a look for a book by Barbara Sykes 'Understanding and Training Puppies'. She's amazing and helped me so much with my 7 yr old who had real issues at one point. She's not influenced by fashions or fads in dog training, she doesn't advocate lots of toys or treats, but her methods are gentle and calm and she is a BC specialist - can't recommend her highly enough! I think her book addresses all of your concerns, regarding chewing and also socialisation. It's just good common sense backed with a huge amount of experience! Best of luck with your pup - sounds like she has found herself a wonderful home!