josey

Laura, did you have to keep changing the food?

Gentle Lake mentioned that fear can make a border collie express her glands. She does express them when she has fear. She also expresses them when we play ball. I took my vet to the vet to have her anal glands expressed and the next day she had expressed them all over her rear end as it was wet and stinky. The next day I took her to a different vet, and he said that one was 1/2 full and the other 3/4. Only dark liquid comes out. Today she expressed them on her bed covers, and she had just been to the vet yesterday. He said they are not inflamed. How soon do glands fill up? I am seeing a pattern. She hates being bathed, even if I am only washing her rear end, and she hates being brushed, so if I do any of these things, the next day I will have to bathe her again, and again. I was giving her a grated carrot daily, but I just learned that pumpkin has more fiber. But if it is that she is just afraid, then I don't know what to do.

Thanks again. My intuition told me if he puts a collar on her that shocks or hurts, then she will always think that I am going to hurt her, with or without that collar. I feel for any fear aggressive dog that he handles.

I had watched a video by a dog trainer, who said to never get into a dog's face. He talked about how people are always reaching down to pet dogs. Then I called a dog trainer, who said that my dog was just trying to get me out of her face because she was afraid of me. she felt cornered. both times she hit me in the face she thought I was going to do something to her. he suggested training, but he would put a color on her that would, I am not sure, maybe a shock collar or a punch collar. I don't think so. IN other words, he wanted to set up the situation, and when she lunges, she gets hurt. But what I get out of these two people is to always come at her from the side when I want to pet her, and don't do anything to scare her. I joined that group on FB and am waiting to hear from them.

Thanks so much Wick. I will do that now.

Thanks Gentle Lake, She does have thyroid issues, and Dr. Dodd said that the amount of meds she is on is fine now, so I now have the reports and know what her levels should be, although I thought that the T4 was a little high, but not by much. I noticed this vet doesn't allow anyone to come into the exam room. I don't like it, but I knew if Mocha didn't like going to her I would know. I say this because I had taken her to a vet who took a cyst out of her, and when he picked her up, I warned him first that she would urinate on him. and she did. She spent the night there for surgery, and when they handed her over to me she pulled the leash hard and just wanted out of there. I tried to take her back just to weigh her since we were in the neighborhood, and she was too upset. I knew before that, that I would never take her back to see him, and now I won't even take her there to weigh her on the scale in the waiting room. I like what you said about packing the sample up myself and mailing it if the vet didn't want to do so. I don't think that the vet Mocha was going to knew who Dr. Dodd was, and he didn't seem to want to try to find out. He had given her a thyroid test, but he sent it to our local hospital, and I really wanted Dr. Dodd's lab and advice. He told me later that he had looked up thyroid issues and said that giving her pills would not always help her to lose weight. So he did that much and even suggested the thyroid test to begin with. I sometimes take her back to him for her anal gland, but now I am going to go back to him after this last visit with the vet in regards how she handled the fear aggression issue. It could be that some vets just don't understand fear aggression. That is a good idea to go back to her just for the blood withdrawal, but I noticed that the second one that she had done was with reluctance. Perhaps it was too much work for her too. She still weighs too much. 65 lbs. but she looks leaner and her coat shines now. I don't know if her thyroid problems have anything to do with her fear aggression as she had this fear from a puppy of 8 weeks. She didn't start gaining weight until she was maybe 3 years old, and the thyroid test that was done back then was normal.

Thanks for your posts. Gloria. Actually, she was 8 weeks old when I got her. I wasn't thinking. I just wish that I had not listened to any of the trainers. And now I feel that she and I are walking on egg shells again. She has hated being brushed since she was 8 weeks old, and that has never changed. Most dogs love it. Today, when I brushed her I had to cut out some matts that I should not have been allowed to develop, but I had been ill for a month. I thought to give her animal treats while doing it to see if that would help. It really didn't but she was good. And of course I worry that some day she might poke out my eye or decide to use her teeth, which in a way she does, but she doesn't open her mouth all the way, just exposes them. Basically, I feel that her issue has been with me from the moment she was a puppy. My husband tolerates her but just feels that she isn't a good dog as we can't trust her. But he is good to her. She has never really bonded with us in any way that dogs normally bond. She is not overly excited to see us. When we went on vacation this summer, we left her with my sister for 10 days, and she missed us. When we got back she was glad to see us, but not the tail wagging happy dog, tail wagging, yes. But for the first time since the first day she and I met, she kissed me. She actually got on the couch with me, (my sister allows this) put her paw and head in my lap and then reached up and kissed me. It was very touching. After that it was back to her being alone on her bed or being alone outside, unless we are out walking together or playing ball. I took her to the vet to have her anal glands expressed yesterday. She has only seen this vet about 4 times. I told the vet that Mocha had fear aggression and explained it, showed her my eye, and she said very nonchalantly , "Oh," and turned and walked away. This vet never allows anyone to be with their dog in the treatment room either. I felt horrible with how she reacted to my commits. I only went to her because she was the only vet in town who said that he/she would send my dog's lab to Dr. Dodd in CA. Now I am thinking of going back to the other vet that she also likes. He may have just said, "Oh" too; I don't know. And my husband just thinks I am too sensitive. (As to the lab results, she has thyroid problems, but I put her on Fresh Pet and a grated raw carrot, and her coat is now shinny, and she has lost 5 lbs.) I feel now that I just know some of her other aggressive points, no yelling. And never bend over her to pet her. I just feel so bad for her.

I am sitting here right now with a large black eye from my 10 year old border collie punching me in the face with his nose, hard. I think some border collies are born with fear aggression. My dog started with it when she was 6 weeks old. I have posted on here often. There was a time when two different trainers told me how to handle her, and it made her worse. One said to put her on the ground and knee her. She growled more. Another said to take her by the cheeks and hold then and scream at her, it wanted to attack me then. I held on until she calmed down. Today we wanted to go with us and was at the car. I told her to get into the gate, and she didn't want to come, so I yelled at her. She came in, and then I reached down to pet her when this happened. It has been 3 or more years since the last time. She also lunges at dogs if the come too close. I gave up on her with that. We walk where she doesn't have to meet dogs. Anyway that you do to a dog with fear aggression that scares her it will make them worse. She is a very good dog otherwise. I have talked with the man at border collie rescue, and did this when she was a pup. He just said I had a big problem. It has taken a long time to be able to brush her without her growling, to wash her and to even towel dry her. She used to bump people in the mouth if they tried to pet her. I don't allow people to pet her that don't know her. After two trainers told me how to handle her and after it failed, I read that Fear aggression cannot be met with aggression as it makes them worse. I have had her on raw food before, and it didn't make her more aggressive. She is on Fresh Pet now. If I had known what I did when she first starting growling at me at 6 weeks old I would have taken her back to the kennel where I bought her. I can't give her away for fear someone would have to put her down or someone would get hurt. I can't put her down, but I would if she began using her teeth. But what is the difference. I have a swollen cheek and black eye. Second time in 10 years. Now I know not to yell at her as it frightened her. Dogs with Fear Aggression will also run away from noises, dogs, etc. She can't be off the leash unless it is safe for her. Type in border collie, fear aggression, and it will give you an article by a vet at Border Collie rescue. I wish you the best.

Found a vet that will use Dr. Dodds lab. Thanks again.

GentleLake. I can't add a link here for some reason, but it can be googled: thyroid, border collie rescue. I can type it out: www.bcrescue.org/thyroid.

I also read an article by dr. Nicholas B Carter of Border Collie Rescue, and he said that because Border Collies are bred to run many hours a day, and because pets don't get that exercise, they get fat. And their metabolism is very efficient and so their T4 would be on the lower side. I also read that the normal range for dogs is T4 1 to 4. The first test was found, and her T4 was 1.3. So, I guess I will just have her retested and consider getting her off thyroid med. It would be interesting to see what others think of this though.

Hi, I had my dog tested for thyroid at a vet, and he said that the T4 came back as 1. So he put her on thyroid med, and then the T4 was 4.4 high. She has not been doing good on her medication, and I got my last test result, but the hospital didn't have the first one and neither did the dr. I read online that T4 is normal at 1. (This number could have been over 1 but certainly not 2. but this is for humans, so what is the difference? can I lower her meds?

What I found the vet gave her is Soloxine. hope she will begin to feel better and lose weight. thanks again.

hi, I am just opposed to synthetic drugs, but after reading what Dr. Dodd said, it seems like levothyroxine is a better choice, that is, if it is a brand name and not generic. thanks.

i will try dr. jean dodds, as I have called every vet here and live in a very small town away from everything. I just want a starting dose so that my dog doesn't get too much, and then in 6 weeks I can have her tested again. thank you.