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#21 Valhalla

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 08:45 AM

Bess is white factored - white running up inside of hind legs
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Rook is not - little white in inside of hind legs
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#22 Valhalla

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 08:55 AM

McCloud is white factored - white over hips and back

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#23 juliepoudrier

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 09:39 AM

Nicole,
The broad areas of white on your dog's hind legs (inside and out) are an indication of white factoring. The white patch on his back would be another indicator, IMO.

J.

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#24 border_collie_crazy

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 09:59 AM

Misty is white factored, here is the best pic I could find that shows the white on her rear leg, she also has tufts of white hair sprinkled throught the black, it drives me crazy lol

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#25 prosperia

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 10:15 AM

Not even a single white hair on her back/rump, but she does have white running up the inside front of her back legs(a little less white than Christine's Bess). The back/inside is black/tan with white under her tail.
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#26 2 Devils

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 11:34 AM

Tempe is also white-factored

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#27 MaggieDog

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Posted 24 June 2006 - 09:05 AM

Well I've been told Maggie is probably double white factored but with the ticking gene expressed...

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#28 Bordercentrics

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 01:11 PM

We don't own either of these dogs. I pulled Lucinda out of SpokAnimal Care for Mary Ann Lindsey of Inland Northwest Rescue. She is available for adoption, but she isn't yet listed on Petfinder. She has one blue eye and we thought she might be an Aussie mix, but Mary Ann said she is all BC.

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Sam was another shelter dog at Spokane Regional Animal Protection Service (SCRAPS). He was adopted from the shelter.

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#29 Anda

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 01:26 PM

I have to ask... Is Ouzo white-factored, too?
Here's a picture of him as a pup (3 months)

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The only white he has on his back legs is almost on his belly, which now is much less evident. The white is not at all visible when he's on all fours. See below:

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Plenty of white on his ears. I'll try to take a picture of him belly up and show you.

#30 Pipedream Farm

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 01:42 PM

No need for a belly up shot. You're looking for white that goes up the back leg connecting to the white on the belly. He clearly does not have that. Look for white hairs or patches on the back or sides in the black fur --it doesn't have to be very big.
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#31 Anda

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 01:51 PM

Absolutly nothing white on his back. Just the tip of his tail, and that doesn't count.
Thanks, Mark & Renee

#32 Jo&Tex

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Posted 25 June 2006 - 03:56 PM

What an interesting thread. My little blue merle pup has a fully white head. There is a thick stripe of white running from hip to hip across his back. He is profoundly deaf and someone still has to finish colouring in his nose. What future health problems should I be worrying about?

Edited to say I've been doing my homework and answered my own questions. Loki does have erratic pupils but no sign of any visual impairment.

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#33 J.E.S

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Posted 27 June 2006 - 12:22 PM

You can see the white clearly going up the hind leg on Seth in this pic. The white went up in a band over his back to the opposite leg when he was a very young puppy. You can't even find white hairs on his back now though. But you can pull it up and see the white right above his leg.

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#34 wyndrunhr

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 04:18 PM

So Mark and Renee,

 

Let's see if I've got this straight?

 

Dog with white front legs extending up front legs and beyond the elbows and neck to collar but no white on the back or sides (other than white collar) and no white on the inside of back legs extending from paws up above hocks and the dog is NOT white factored?

 

So a dog could have all white up front legs and collar but if there were no white on the BACK legs on the inside above the hocks, and no white on the body or sides, the dog is NOT white factored? 

 

I think what I'm hearing you say is that the head color and the front legs color does not matter in white factoring?  It's all about the body and rear legs?

 

Thanks, trying to get this really right because I just heard today from a breeder that if the front legs have white above the elbows, even if all the rest of the dog is black, that dog is white factored?

 

 



#35 juliepoudrier

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 05:02 PM

Wyndrunhr,

I'm not Mark or Renee (and it's usually Mark who posts), but white factoring is determined by the color on the back legs and over the hips. You will see plenty of dogs who have white legs that extend up into their white collars, and that is not white factoring. I think that would be considered just typical Irish marking.

 

Almost every one of my non-white factored dogs, even the mostly black dog, has white legs extending up into the white collar. The dark dog has white on her belly that extends slightly up one of her sides, but that's not an indication of white factoring either, because she's not white factored.

 

Here are two links to genetic discussions of white patterning or spotting:

http://homepage.usas...z/dogspots.html

 

http://bowlingsite.m...s/colorgen.html

 

I think the U. Sask site is more up-to-date.

 

I didn't reread the rest of this old thread to see if these sites were posted earlier--apologies if it's a repeat.

 

J.


I know nothing with any certainty, but the sight of stars makes me dream.

~Vincent van Gogh



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Julie Poudrier
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#36 Kian's Mom

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 08:28 PM

So is this a good thing or bad thing or really dosent matter? My R/W must be as she has white running up the inside of her back legs, Not visible when looking at her from the sides but looking underneath you can see it

Jan



#37 Liz P

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 08:34 PM

Bad if you breed two together and you don't want all white pups. 


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#38 juliepoudrier

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 08:46 PM

Well except that I bred two together (one my Twist who is closer to the piebald end of the spectrum and the stud a dog who on a simple glance might not have been noticed as white factored (sort of like Christine's Bess in the photo at the top of this page of this thread) and I didn't get a litter of all-white puppies. What I got (out of 8 puppies) was as follows:

 

1 very dark dog with minimal white (a tiny bit of white on his muzzle, chest and paws), and what white there was was heavily ticked

2 classically marked dogs, neither showing signs of white factor

1 marked more like the sire, that is classically marked except with white going up toward the stifle on the hind leg, so definitely white factored

1 piebald with little ticking

2 white factored and marked similar to their dam (who is on the first page of this thread), but with very heavy ticking so that all of their white areas appear grey (e.g., the dog second from the right on the bottom row in my sig line photo)

1 white dog, with a traditional black mask. He also has a lot of ticking, but it appears mostly under his white guard hairs so is not as obvious as the ticking on his siblings (however if you rub his hair backward, the hair underneath is almost completely black; he's the dog that's second from the left on the bottom row of my sig line photo)

 

So three of the 8 did not appear to carry white factoring, while the other five clearly did. I suppose that means that white factor is not completely dominant.

 

So as with many things related to color genetics, the result isn't always predictable. I had watched the sire work many times and really liked him and had not paid any attention to the fact that he was white factored. And yes, once I realized it I worried I'd have a litter of white puppies, but that turned out not to be the case, so either it was just a lucky exception to the "rule" or breeding white factor to white factor doesn't automatically mean that you're going to get all-white puppies. I suspect it's the latter, but that the amount of white on each parent probably plays a role.

 

J.. 


I know nothing with any certainty, but the sight of stars makes me dream.

~Vincent van Gogh



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Julie Poudrier
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Willow (6/1997-5/2014, run free, my heart), Boy (3/1995-10/2010, RIP), Jill (8/1996-5/2012, RIP), Farleigh (12/1998-7/2014, RIP), Kat, Twist, Lark, Phoebe, Pipit, and Birdie!
Willow's Rest, Tunis and mule sheep



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#39 Gideon's girl

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 08:49 PM

Not that it matters, because he is neutered and even if he wasn't, he isn't anywhere near breeding material, but wow, I just found out my R/W is white factored.  I knew that the split face, the tail, the ruff, and the front leg didn't count, but I never would have guessed the two thin lightning bolts up the fronts of his back legs meant anything.  Neither of his parents looked like what I think of as white factored.  Good thing because I personally don't like white factored.  I like learning something new though.



#40 Liz P

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Posted 09 August 2013 - 09:02 PM

It's a matter of grammar and how you read my sentence.  I never said you would get an entire litter of white pups.

 

I happen to not want a pup that's mostly white.  Just personal preference really.


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