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Patroling 15 Acres


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#1 frisbeegirl

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 09:06 AM

Hi,

Have a little dilema.Keeva has gone into heat she is 11 months. Thanks to all of you for giving me the time frame for her first heat.

This post has nothing to do with when she will be spayed( I am not breeding her). I usually let my females go into heat twice before I spay them. My preference.

What I am asking advice about is: from the time I brought her home in October 2011 we have every morning even (Christmas) walked the border of 15 acres. When she was a pup we walked on leash. That has been along time ago. She has been off leash for a long time maybe 7-8 months. She takes this morning hike very seriously, it is part of her job. We do not come in contact with any other dogs (except my 14 year female lab), cars, or people. We do however, come in contact with a wide assortment of wildlife. We move the wildlife but do not chase (most of the time).

My question is what do you guys think? Do I dare do this while she is in heat? Offleash?

Thanks
Robin





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Keeva (BC 20 months)Somebody left the gate open........Whoo Hoo!
Kate (Choc Lab 15 years)


#2 beachdogz

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 09:16 AM

I can only say this: 35 years ago, when we moved into our first apartment, I noticed this little dog who would come and sit on the step of the house across from ours. He wouldn't move for about a week; he was there day and night...then he was gone. I noticed this happened randomly, so I figured he didn't live there. Later, when I got to know my neighbors better, they told me he came every time their female was in season. He had tags, and they contacted the owners (who obviously didn't seem to care.) They would come get him, but evidently didn't watch him, and he would be back on the step the next day. The amazing thing is that he lived about 5 miles away! They said they finally just got used to him being there, and stopped calling the owners. True story.

So...I would leash her while in season. I might even not walk her on her "receptive" days. Better safe than sorry. :)
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#3 Maralynn

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 10:12 AM

Yup - keep her leashed. Males can smell a female in heat from miles away so she needs to be contained (fenced yard or leash) AND supervised while she's in heat.

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#4 Cynthia P

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 11:48 AM

Leash her. We live on 130 acres and sometimes when we have a bitch or two in season we have the male pit mix sitting on our front stoop.

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#5 bcnewe2

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 02:17 PM

I'm from another camp. My dogs are trained sheep dogs. They listen when I say something. Not saying anyone else's dogs don't but just our situation. So her recall is something I trust even in standing heat. Now if she were to be tied to a male I would say my recall was to late. But when walking our property I can see them at all times. Or I would make her stay close to me if I couldn't.

Dew is not fixed. I don't let her out without supervision when she's in heat and I have had stray dogs come wandering around when she's in who I have had to send home one way or another. I have never had a situation come up where I wasn't in control enough that I couldn't get her away from her love pursuers.

I have had her in training to trialing situations where she's in heat and with strict management we're fine. Strict management means not ever letting my eye off her unless she was locked away in the car or house. Not even a crate as it invites males up to crate sniff and I want none of that either.

What does a leash do? If she's being attacked by hormonal males I think a leash would provide little protection. But if you feel safer with her on a leash then go for it. It's more a containment issue if there are strays around.

Just my opinion...

Dew is 6, I've never had an issue and no woops litters have we had. We hang with people who don't normally have altered dogs. In my mind it's the male dogs owner who needs to keep his male away from my female or I will do it for him and his dog won't be happy with that! Not saying that other people feel that way either but I do and I will knock a dog out of our way if he's after Dew when she is open. That's my responsibility keeping her intact and I take it very serious. I feel it's a privilege to keep your dog intact that comes with huge responsibilities!

opinions are varied and you have to judge what is best for you.

BTW Dew is due to be spayed in a week! I worry I will need her for sheep but it's hot and I'll have to make do without my Dew for a week or 2.
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#6 frisbeegirl

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 02:34 PM

Thank You Kristen,

I am so proud of my recall. Keeva's eye is always looking for me on our morning patrol, however as we all know border collies distant is all relative.

I also thought about what am I going to do if a male comes around on leash or off leash.

Intack is what I want also at all costs.

Keeva loves this time and I am afraid the leash will compromise that.

It is also so hot here so maybe we can minimize everything for a couple weeks.

Robin





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Keeva (BC 20 months)Somebody left the gate open........Whoo Hoo!
Kate (Choc Lab 15 years)


#7 Cynthia P

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 02:36 PM

If she has a great recall and you can fend off a wandering male than no worries. My girls are off leash when in heat however I usually have a neutered male or two with them and they have very very good recalls

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#8 Kelleybean

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 03:42 PM

I certainly wouldn't risk and unwanted litter just because you don't want to compromise your daily walks. IMO that's just an inconvenience that comes with having an intact female. Leash her, or even better, keep her inside!
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#9 mbc1963

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 04:21 PM

I've never had an unfixed female. But, in the 70s (a different time), my family had an intact male. He broke through the glass of the small basement window of the house across the street, went through the shards, and fell down into the basement to get at the female in heat over there.

I wouldn't want to get between that dedication!

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#10 geonni banner

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 04:26 PM

I agree that the best place for a bitch in heat is indoors. But that isn't always a sinecure. Really determined males have been known to break windows to get to a bitch in heat.

If she is going out in your yard to pee, she is leaving a scent-beacon that will draw the boys from miles away.

Constant vigilance is essential. IMO when she is in standing heat, if you can't see her, she should be crated.

Your girl my have a rock-solid recall, but your neighbors' males don't care. There are good "doggie britches" on the market, but they aren't cheap.


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#11 urge to herd

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 04:33 PM

If there's a large dog running loose, like the Akita that visited Samantha a couple times when she was in heat, you'll want to re-think that.

Samantha was luckily in a fenced yard. The Animal Control officer who showed up took a couple steps back when he saw the Akita. Also luckily for everyone one of my neighbors recognized the dog and knew where he lived. It could have been a really, really bad thing.

Staying home a few weeks won't damage Keeva's spirit, nor will being kept close to you. An attack by a strange dog probably would. A leash wouldn't be much defense, I agree with Kristen.

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#12 Kelleybean

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 05:00 PM

When I was a kid, our intact German Shepard went into heat. My parents kept her in a screened porch that was on the back of our house surrounded by a fence. A male poodle dug under the fence and tore the screen away. Our dog tried to fight the poodle off and my Mom came after it swinging a baseball bat. Fortunately, no puppies happened but our dog needed several stitches to close a large gash on her belly. Don't underestimate a determined male.
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#13 frisbeegirl

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 05:55 PM

I sincerely Thank all of You for your replies. I am doing as much work inside to keep her from getting bored. I appreciate the comment that staying home will not damage Keeva's spirit.

I am not worried about a male coming through the window, but I believe that it happens.

We will stick close to home. I am always with her outside even when working. We will limit outside time for the next 3 weeks.

Here's counting the days.Attached File  IMG_5360 (1024x683).jpg   369.38K   16 downloads





Robin

Keeva (BC 20 months)Somebody left the gate open........Whoo Hoo!
Kate (Choc Lab 15 years)


#14 bcnewe2

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 08:10 PM

So let me get this straight, some of you would keep your bitch inside at all times while she is in heat?

I owned one of those terriers that broke a neighbors door down to get to a female in heat. He managed to break the screen door but didn't get to breed the female. The owners kicked his little butt right back out the door. I know they are out there. But I will also say, I know I can control my dog or any other dog that comes around us enough that they won't get tied to my bitch cause I'm watching. You can see it happening and stop it if need be. It's not like they are attacking me to get to her. Just determined. Breaking a window or a screen door is a far cry from going though a human to get to a bitch.

Or else maybe in my lifetime of bitches in heat I've not met that one dog that can get through my diligence.

I'm not saying go out and advertise like walking down a dog crowded street or go to pet smart while she is standing but geesh Frisbee girl says they walk their own property I think she knows her own property well enough and I bet can fend off a male that might sneak up on them. Again a leash will do what to that male dog?

A few months ago, Dew and I were at a friends helping worm sheep. He has a stud dog there that is his right hand man as Dew is mine. He has bred quite a few females so he knows what that smell is really all about.
Dew was standing (I knew she was in heat but not actually standing till I got there) we worked all day the dogs were together doing sheep things, and then when it was time to rest Dew was at my feet (yes on a leash cause I had figured out she was standing and didn't want to hassle with watching her every movement) and his dog lay at his feet. Yes there was love in the air but no one got bit or bred and it wasn't that big a deal. Just saying....be responsible and I think you got it covered.
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#15 Maralynn

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 09:35 PM

Perhaps it would be prudent to forego the walks until you know how Keeva reacts to being in heat and see if any amorous males show up at your doorstep? I handled a female in heat without limiting her too much. But I knew my dog and the situation. And possibly it would be no issue to continue the routine. However I am not really comfortable telling a person that I don't really know who is in a situation that I am not familiar with that it should be fine to continue on with life as normal with a dog that is in heat. Because life can happen when you least expect it.

Mara
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#16 urge to herd

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 09:47 PM

I'm not saying to keep Keeva inside, just at home. When the Akita I mentioned previously showed up with flowers and a bow tie on, I was really, really glad Sam was in our yard behind a 6 ft fence. There is no way I would have been able to keep a dog that large and that driven by hormones away from Sam if we had been out and about. I agree, a leash would have been no help at all.

If frisbeegirl is sure there are no intact males in the area where she walks Keeva, then she might choose to walk her. I didn't know there was a large, intact male Akita a couple blocks from our home until he showed up.

DH was scoffing at my concern when I trotted into the house and dialed Animal Control. Then he peeked over the fence and said, "My God, that's not a dog, it's a pony."

Kicking an Akita off my property is a little beyond me.

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#17 Rave

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 07:33 AM

You know I'd always heard the stories of males showing up when a female is in heat, so when I finally had a girl go through a heat, I was ready to beat them off with sticks (lol). Can't say I saw one strange dog during her entire heat. I walked her (on leash) on the two-mile trail by our house and she was off-leash romping through the fields at my house. This of course is purely anecdotal, but I did find it amusing I was so worried about strange male dogs showing up and not one did. Lucky I guess.

#18 juliepoudrier

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:33 AM

I've never had issues with intact males showing up either (though my mother did, when I was too little to remember; she used to talk about the male dacshund who scaled a barn wall and went in through a window to get to a female German shepherd <--unsuccessfully since my mother was there to stop it). I walk my dogs as a pack even when the females are in heat. I no longer have any intact males, but when I did, we still walked in a pack. If the male showed interest in the female, he was corrected, verbally.

I think the most important thing is to know your dog and how she behaves when in heat. If she's the sort to "lose her mind" and blow you off when she's in heat then obviously you'd need to act accordingly. If she still has a good recall and stays with you on walks, then I see no reason not to walk her. Carry a stick with you if you're concerned about a male showing up out of nowhere. It's really just a matter of common sense. In a more dog-populated area, I'd be more careful about where we went and how, but on my own acreage, I'd not be overly concerned, given the caveats I already stated.

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#19 frisbeegirl

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 08:42 AM

Felt so bad for Keeva this morning. I choose to do the 15 acre walk on leash. She walked with her head down the whole time. As far as I could tell no enjoyment what so ever. No contact with any unsuspecting males. Visted the horses on my farm a little more excitement. But something funny happened she seemed to have a cramp in her front leg. I thought she was getting bit by a horse fly but there was nothing there.

We went inside and played some flyball training ( yes I have 40 feet area set up.) This she seemed to enjoy.

I do not think she is getting enough time to run.

She needs to run.

Am I wrong thinking this?





Robin

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Kate (Choc Lab 15 years)


#20 Rave

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Posted 12 July 2012 - 09:53 AM

I don't think you need to leash her during her entire heat. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe there are only a few days when she is in standing heat (i.e. able to be bred). During THESE days you may want to take more precaution.

Are you using a flexi lead? That can give your dog some more freedom to run than a short leash.


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