29 replies to this topic

[ShoresDog]

What a bunch of great replies. I've heard a story about a very admired and cool-headed handler, Bev Lambert, who sent her dog to water in the midst of a hot double-lift final, and then back on the course had time to finish well. I hope it's true!

[DeltaBluez Tess]

I ran Nan and Lucy in a Double Lift a couple of years ago.(separate trials)....Both gathered the two flocks and turned the post. It was over 90 degrees on both days. I stopped the dogs at my feet and let the sheep settle halfway to the first panel. I told Nan and Lucy to "Get in the water" and both ran to the tubs. I let them sit for close to two minutes until I saw their tongues were not hanging out so much. (I timed it on my watch so I had an idea). Both trials provided water for the dogs and the only penalty would be the time loss if you sent your dog to the water.

Both came out and finished the course with ease. I didn't get the shed with Lucy but got the shed with Nan and the pen. Both dogs had enough at the end. Nan got 2nd with only one point from first place.

With Lucy, if we had the two minutes that I gave up at the water tub, we would have gotten the shed....but in my eyes, the life of my dog is not worth the win. It's a partnership and on my end, my part to make sure my partner can do the job and not be compromised. The dogs trust me to do right by them.

I teach all of my dogs "Get in the water".....as well as the "Wait in the water" release command.

On both of those trials some of the handlers did NOT put their dogs in the water....what I saw was at the end of the runs the dog was flagged out and brains shut down, the handler yelling and no team work.

Diane

[Laurae]

What a bunch of great replies. I've heard a story about a very admired and cool-headed handler, Bev Lambert, who sent her dog to water in the midst of a hot double-lift final, and then back on the course had time to finish well. I hope it's true!

I am happy to report that many handlers do this routinely during the double lift finals at Meeker.

[Shoofly]

And at the Finals, and at Kingston...

[G. Festerling]

A: I am proud of the way you handled it. No question that the handler was out of line.

B: Me and a friend where talking about the breaking for water issue. A trainer from many years ago, that I still hold in high regard, had a major issue with that. But he qualified his stance with pointing out that in the real life field of working stock, this could present a lot of problems (he was not a trial person). And even there he always made a point to express that it is ultimately the handlers job to know how much to dog can do without putting the dog in jeopardy. To him the dogs where such valuable help that them getting hurt was simply not going to be ok.

C: I can only assume that the handler that did this has little regard and understanding about the importance and the non importance of a sheep dog trial respectively.

[gcv-border]

In answer to your questions about reporting the incident, no I did not, probably should have...and I recieved no reply from the subsequent email I sent her...so obviously she still didn't get the message. Should something like this happen again, I will be sure and report it.

First, let me say that what you witnessed is abhorrent behavior, and I applaud you for speaking up - and speaking up several times at that.

It seems that this incident is weighing heavy on your mind. IMO, it is not too late to report this handler to the appropriate parties.

I admit that I might have been too "shy" (for lack of a better word) to report such an incident if it had happened 20, 10 or maybe even 5 years ago. But as I have aged I worry less about what people may think if I feel that I did the "right" thing.

Jovi

[ItsADogsLyfe]

At a sheepdog demo where Seth worked his arse off covering for everyone elses sheep, one of the men who was "in charge" asked me to bring Seth over so the audience could pet him. I said after he gets water. The man insisted I bring him NOW. I said NO, my dog's welfare comes first and I'm taking him to water! The other man who had brought the sheep had a reputation for being rough with dogs. I had heard he would hold the dogs under water to "teach" them. Not sure what that would teach them but to be afraid of him.

[Tea]

In regards to work.


When I move sheep I do it when its cool, morning and evening in the hot weather.

If I move them far, I rest them and my dogs, and horse in the shade halfway. I carry water. Or have water along the trails or in the fields.

If I am sorting for whatever work I need to do, I will let a tired dog have a break and let a fresh dog take over. Thats why I have a team of dogs.


I have never have I found myself in a position where I absolutely needed to work a dog or a horse or my stock to exhaustion.


It is cruel and also counter productive.

[PSmitty]

Betty, you totally handled it appropriately, and I would have done the same. Thank you on the dog's behalf!

I'm just dismayed to read this, and the stories that Julie and KathyF shared. Unbelievable! OK, really it's not, there are jackasses in every walk of life.

Betty, there was a similar situation that happened at a trial in this area a couple of summers ago. A dog was quite hot at the end of the run (the run was over), it went to the tub that had been provided for dogs coming off of the field, and the handler roughly pulled the dog out of the tub by its collar (while loudly reprimanding the dog for going to the tub without permission). Several handlers lodged formal complaints regarding the handler's behavior, and the host club suspended the handler for one year for unsportsmanlike conduct and mistreatment of the dog. So, please continue to let it be known that such behavior is unacceptable at trials, and I agree with those who suggested that this incident be brought to the attention of the trial hosts/managers.

Regards,
nancy

Love the suspension, that's just how it should be. Thanks for sharing this.

[Foggy]

So I'm new to this sport (but not new to heat exhaustion-my own experience or veterinary medicine-I am a vet). I can't imagine denying a dog water when they need it....

I have a hard time in the summer heat with my dog (and it rarely hits 80 here) because he doesn't want to stop for water. I have to make sure he rests, drinks and gets cool. If he told me he had to drink and cool off, I'd be sure that he got the chance.....

If a dog is quitting and running to the water when they shouldn't, it seems there are bigger holes in your training that you need to worry about.....

To the OP, good for you for standing up for the dog....

People that hold their dogs under water for correction? I don't know what to say.....

I have spent many years involved with competition horses and I guess it's the same in the dog world....Some people just have no business with animals.....