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"Working Lines"


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#41 Sue R

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 05:33 PM

She's gonna be a cowdog - but Rustle might give the wrong impression...
Sue Rayburn - Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult, but not the brightest firefly in the jar.

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#42 stockdogranch

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 09:44 PM

Haha! You got it! That's exactly the meaning I was after... :D
A
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#43 Pam Wolf

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Posted 03 November 2010 - 11:57 PM

Gee, I guess I remember a different scene from that movie :(

As far as my dogs are concerned, they don't care what anyone calls them as long as they are called to work stock.


When Harry Met Sally!

And she does look like a cute little dumpling ... for now! I imagine her becoming a bit more shark-like Raskle-like as she grows!


I'd rather be a shepherd than a sheepdogger

#44 stockdogranch

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Posted 04 November 2010 - 07:21 AM

Gee, I guess I remember a different scene from that movie :(

You mean the, "I'll have what she's having"? ;)
A
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#45 urge to herd

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Posted 04 November 2010 - 09:27 AM

On the other topic... I've had people try to argue with me that my dogs couldn't possibly be border collies. :lol:


Yeah, more than one person has told me that Samantha wasn't a bc because 'they don't come in that color'.
Really, it's taught me a lot about keeping my mouth shut.

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#46 HoosierMike

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Posted 04 November 2010 - 12:29 PM

I would venture a guess that Mr. McCaig is trying very hard to use
this thread, in some way, in an upcoming book.

Chapter 4... From Barbies to Noodles

#47 PennyT

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Posted 04 November 2010 - 05:37 PM

I agree, and I don't think the point was to tout "Bred for Perfection." Although the writer lacked the stockdog background to do her collie section justice, it's still well worth the time.

If Donald were saying "Animal Estate" is good reading, which it is, then he would have said that as well.

Penny

#48 Donald McCaig

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 06:01 AM

Dear Sheepdoggers,
Mr. Mike writes, of this thread (and I gather my friend Penny agrees with him:


"I would venture a guess that Mr. McCaig is trying very hard to use
this thread, in some way, in an upcoming book.

Chapter 4... From Barbies to Noodles

No thanks. "The Dog Wars" was -I devoutly hope - my last foray into dog politics.

Donald McCaig

#49 hsnrs

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 10:55 AM

Love the term "real" working dogs.

#50 geonni banner

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Posted 06 November 2010 - 06:33 PM

So here’s the story I’ve been telling people when they ask what kind of dog Sugarfoot is…
Once upon a time there was a lovely type of sheepdog created in the Border Country between England and Scotland. They were called Border Collies. They were famed throughout the world as the sheepdog with the most brains, stamina and ability of all the herding dogs. They came in all colors and kinds of coats. Some had ears that hung down, some had ears that stood up, and some had ears that tipped over at the ends. But in one thing they were all the same. They were superb stock dogs, and their owners’ livelihoods literally depended upon them.
Eventually, some of these dogs made their was here to the USA, where they continued to be the fine workers that they had always been, and their great variety in form and coat length made them useful in all sorts of different terrain, with everything from half-wild range cattle to the gentlemen farmer’s roly-poly pedigreed sheep.
This happy state of affairs continued right up to modern times, when one day the AKC noticed these useful animals.
“Well, well!” said the AKC. “Here’s a dog that is smart, fast and agile! It’s probably just the thing for us! Our German Shepherd Dogs are all crippled, and our Shetland Sheepdogs are tiny, neurotic, non-stop barkers. We need a healthy, attractive dog for all those dog owners who insist on doing sports with purebred dogs.”
“But, wait! They continued, “These dogs all look so different! This won’t do! We must RECOGNIZE this breed and make sure that they all look just alike so our judges can tell what they are. They must have lovely, white, symmetrical markings and black bodies. And all these colors! That won’t do!“
“They must have tipped ears so they’ll be SWEET LOOKING. And they must be very, very fluffy so people won’t notice the terrible things that will happen to their bodies after they’ve been SHOW DOGS for 100 generations.”
And so the AKC recognized the Border Collie. And now the average person, not knowing that the AKC stands on a foundation of millions of corpses of feces-covered puppy-mill puppies and their parents, grandparents, and so on, (and the registration fees they collect for them) thinks that the AKC’s version of the Border Collie is the real deal.
Frankly, I feel that the name “Border Collie” has been forever dishonored by this sad sequence of events. I want no part of it. So I made up a new name for the hardy, brave, sagacious and talented working sheepdogs of the breed formerly known as the Border Collie.
I call ‘em Anglo-American Stock Dogs. Nobody else has to – but that’s what they are to me.
I don’t know if my dog’s parents worked sheep or cattle, ducks or geese. She’s a rescue. But looking at her I’d say it’s a pretty safe bet they didn’t spend their lives lumbering around a breed ring like Golden Retrievers in fuzzy penguin suits. So I call her my little Anglo-American Stock Dog. And if doG is good to us, maybe someday she will get her chance to show what she is made of with a good trainer and some sheep. And maybe her real Border Collie ancestors – those long-dead, pre-AKC hill-farm warriors will look down on her with approval, and slowly wag their tails.

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#51 PennyT

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Posted 08 November 2010 - 09:21 AM

"So here’s the story I’ve been telling people when they ask what kind of dog Sugarfoot is…"

Do they fall asleep then turn into skeletons before you're finished? I think the movie was "Airplane".

Donald, I suppose "Bred for Perfection" and "Animal Estate" are political in the sense they reevaluate historical events previously considered to be culturally neutral or beneficial or worthy of no more than a contemptuous sentence or two from someone like Veblen. What I'm curious about, as I suppose Mike is as well, is whether or how your post on working lines fits into your new book.

Oh, come on. Just a teaser. If you're writing about what pet dog and other trainers across the globe can do for the reading pleasure of everyone who buys books, then the subject of breed nicknames as misrepresentation in certain circumstances might be worth some pages.

Penny

"Go 'long," [the future Sir Boss] said; "you ain't more than a paragraph."

Edit: Never mind. Given that "Jacob's Ladder" is considered "the best Civil War novel ever written" and that the reticent author visited some 19th century battlefields in the west rather recently, I think we're out of luck on dog related essays or a novel and the subject may be genocide.

#52 Donald McCaig

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Posted 08 November 2010 - 10:36 AM

Dear Penny,
You asked:
"What I'm curious about, as I suppose Mike is as well, is whether or how your post on working lines fits into your new book.'

Been a while since I read the new dog book AKA "Mr & Mrs. Dog: Our trials, travels, adventures and epiphanies". I think I wrote about about the underpinnings of dog training but don't think I said anything about lines. On the rare occasions I have an IDEA I try to get at least two books out of it. My post on working lines wasn't even an IDEA - just stating the obvious.


Donald

#53 geonni banner

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Posted 08 November 2010 - 11:31 AM

"So here’s the story I’ve been telling people when they ask what kind of dog Sugarfoot is…"

Do they fall asleep then turn into skeletons before you're finished? I think the movie was "Airplane".


Well, I haven't had that happen yet, but it does either cause them to suddenly remember something very important they had to do. And sometimes they actually listen to the whole rigamarole and then want to know more. Either way I avoid the stupid argument about, "Oh, that can't be a Border Collie - it must be a mix." And anyway, it's fun. Some people actually get that it's supposed to be funny... ;)


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#54 Crawford Dogs

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Posted 17 November 2010 - 04:31 PM

I always say mine are working lines or working bred if their parents are working dogs (yes, I have had one backyard/competition bred and one shelter border collie). I have seen people refer to their dogs as working lines although they don't do any training, trialing, or work but typically working lines/bred means to me that the parents work stock.
I am always amazed by AKC and their adherance to a made-up standard. Ran into a lady who was furious with her 10 month old show border collie for being 1" too short and 2 lbs too light. When I said, well it really doesn't matter there's lots you can do together she said, "it matters to me." Wow, lets all be angry at our dogs for something beyond their control! Funnily enough, my 10 mo. puppy (both parents work & he is training on stock also) meets the AKC standards and several people have asked me when I plan to show him. So hard not to lose my temper or laugh at them.

#55 Chantal

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 11:52 PM

Personally, as somebody who has heard all sorts of guesstimates from strangers on Mick's breed, I'll say he's a Border Collie. Which will invariably, lead to "Is he a mix?" or "But he doesn't look like one." Then, I'll tell them he's a working bred Border Collie, and that he was bred to work, not to look big and fluffy like a show-bred one.


What a familiar speech I go through , you get the show ring die hards know it alls where I just have to smile and walk away, and then you get the great people whom i love interacting with who appreciate the new knowledge of why so many border collies don't look like border *cough, barbie* collies. Nice conversation starter anyway for the latter ;)

#56 Mark Billadeau

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 07:50 AM

We passed someone on a walking trail one day many years ago and they asked us about our dog (smooth tri with "airplane ears"). When asked I told them she was a Border Collie. They asked Border Collie and what? I responded, Border Collie and Border Collie. :)

There's nothing I believe in more strongly than getting young people interested in science and engineering, for a better tomorrow, for all humankind.

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