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Miniature Border Collies


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#1 Flamincomet

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 12:37 AM

Yesterday my fiance called me from work to inform me that his boss's wife has purchased what the breeder claims to be a miniature border collie. This obviously upset me very much, and I asked for the phone number of the breeder, and offered help to the boss if he ever needed it. (As I'm assuming they don't know much about BCs if they think mini BCs are legitimate) The next day I gave my fiance puppy pads that we never used (We bought a pack of 50 when Ghost was 8 weeks, and after he shredded 2 to bits we never used another) along with about 5 pages of useful info on the BC breed to give to them, with my offer of continued help if they ever needed it. I was most concerned when I heard that the pup was already jumping up on their 1 year old daughter, so I thought they would welcome any help.

Well, the boss was very polite and thanked us, but about 45 minutes before my fiance's shift was over, he was motioned over by the wife, where she was extremely rude to him, resorting to abusive language, and basically said that she knew everything about the breed and didn't need anyone's help.

I still offered help to the boss if he ever needs it, but have given up on having a reasonable conversation with the wife. I am looking forward to that pup hitting 6 months of age needless to say.

Reguardless, this is very distressing information, and I am hoping that this problem is not too wide spread. Has anyone else heard anything of this sort?

Autumn

#2 Sue R

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 05:56 AM

There is quite a market for "mini" versions of several breeds. The "mini-Aussie" is one that is popular. I think it's along the lines of folks wanting those tiny "teacup" poodles and Chihuahuas.

It is another example of people breeding irresponsibly (and sometimes it involves cross-breeding with other breeds to achieve the smaller sizes, like Border Collie and Papillion) for an unimportant trait that will make puppies sell well (and often at inflated prices) to a gullible and often selfish (that's what *I want* and I don't care what it takes to get it) public.

I just hope your finance's boss's wife gets over her snit and someday opens her eyes and heart to someone who tries to be kind and helpful.

Thanks to you two for trying, and best wishes!
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#3 juliepoudrier

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 07:41 AM

Mini border collies--it's inevitable I suppose. I'd say the woman's ignorance is astounding if she didn't realize that miniature isn't something border collies are supposed to come in (so much for knowing everything about the breed). I hope when the family runs out of patience with the poor thing that your husband's boss will remember your kind offer and let you help them find a rescue for the dog. At least you tried, and hopefully you'll be able to help when it really counts down the road.

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#4 Dalesred

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 08:01 AM

Oh my.
Distressing. Disgusting. Irresponsible. And sad.

Well done for stepping up so kindly to offer help and advice.
Like others said, they'll maybe remember you in six to eight months' time.
For the dog's sake. I really hope so.
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#5 AK dog doc

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 12:08 PM

Unfortunately, the mini Aussies I've seen - and admittedly, that's maybe only six or so - have ALL had temperament issues. ALL of them. Two have been shy/skittish, borderline fear aggressive and just kind of weird, and four have been outright fear AND dominance aggresive, and considerably weirder. I can only imagine what temperamental disasters might be produced by this idiotic mania for a mini BC.

Autumn, it was kind of you to offer help in the first place, and to RE-offer it to the boss after the wife's rudeness - that shows a sincere desire to help, rather than an ego-based one (I'M the EXPERT, let me show off my prowess to you peons!) Unfortunately, the wife's professed expertise sounds like it is ENTIRELY ego-based. That generally spells disaster.

I can only hope this craze does not catch on. Ugh. If you want a little B&W dog, get a Papillon. They're adorable, and they're already mini. If you want a tiny collie, get a Sheltie. Also adorable and also mini. Jeez. What POSSIBLE need do we have for a mini BC?
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#6 Shetlander

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 12:58 PM

I can only hope this craze does not catch on. Ugh. If you want a little B&W dog, get a Papillon. They're adorable, and they're already mini. If you want a tiny collie, get a Sheltie. Also adorable and also mini.


You can even get a bi-black shetlie like my first one was. He was a bit oversized and people at agility shows sometimes asked me if he was a small BC. Until they saw him move. BC's just don't prance anywhere near like a sheltie :rolleyes:. I heard yesterday about people deliberately breeding "mini shelties." I've seen 11 inch shelties and wasn't impressed with the looks so can't imagine intentionally breeding for that, which really brings us back to get a Pap or a Pom if you want that small and fluffy.

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#7 Liz P

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 03:03 PM

You can even get a bi-black shetlie like my first one was. He was a bit oversized and people at agility shows sometimes asked me if he was a small BC. Until they saw him move. BC's just don't prance anywhere near like a sheltie :rolleyes:. I heard yesterday about people deliberately breeding "mini shelties." I've seen 11 inch shelties and wasn't impressed with the looks so can't imagine intentionally breeding for that, which really brings us back to get a Pap or a Pom if you want that small and fluffy.


I have met several Shelties that were under 10 lbs, one was FIVE and full grown (4 yrs old)!!! YIKES! I asked the owner if it had a shunt or other medical condition and said that he was in perfect health.

I agree about the mini Aussies, I've never met one that wasn't extremely fearful.

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#8 OffTopic

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 03:30 PM

If you want a little B&W dog, get a Papillon. They're adorable, and they're already mini.

Apparently you can even get little B&W poms.
A bit off the main topic, but this video makes me grin from ear to ear. I want the little B&W (or tri, looks like some brown on the face maybe) one with the white tip on it's tail.
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#9 juliepoudrier

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 04:08 PM

I just gotta ask: What was with that poor tiny little critter that looks like a guinea pig and comes in and out of the picture walking slowly along the baseboards? Runt (and I mean runt!) of the litter? Some other litter? I'm afraid I couldn't pay much attention to the rest of the pups I was so busy trying to figure that one out.

And I had no idea pomeranians came in colors other than gold/red.

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#10 AK dog doc

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 04:38 PM

I'm going to guess pup from a different litter (although this does NOT necessarily rule out runtiness, whatever litter it came from).... there are at least 10 puppies there, and I've yet to meet the pom bitch that produced over 6 in a litter (and 2 to 4 is more usual). Hence I'm guessing that there are at least 2 litters extant in that clip, and possibly more. FWIW, it used to be all het Poms we saw were red (ranging from a nearly-blonde to a deep Irish-setter mahogany) or black Poms, with the occasional wof-sable thrown in. Now we see all KINDS of colors.... and all kinds of miniaturization, since everyone looks for the teensiest male to breed to their bitch so the pups won't be too big and require a C-section.

Off to take MY "mini" BC (31# dripping wet, which I know because once I weighed her immediately after a bath so I could know if that was an accurate statement)* :rolleyes: for a ride to the sheep.... not to work, just to deliver hay. But it's an outing to the farm, so she'll be aaaaaall happy.

*Okay. I know 31# isn't really that small for a BC. Just seems like it next to Finn "The Stilt" Grippyboy and Pepper "Wow, SHE'S a Big Bitch!" Bogart.
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#11 dogsofmenace

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 04:47 PM

Ah, I know those mini BC are becoming popular in the agility world. They want a BC at a lower jump height because there are so many 20" BCs. So idiotic. Why don't you just get a sheltie? Or pomeranians and papillions are great little dogs. When you start breeding for color, size, "agility drive" and other stupid stuff you start to lose what makes the border collie a border collie. Pretty soon we'll just have pretty little blue merle border collies jumping 12" with so much drive and energy they can't think straight. :rolleyes:

On a side note...

I just gotta ask: What was with that poor tiny little critter that looks like a guinea pig and comes in and out of the picture walking slowly along the baseboards? Runt (and I mean runt!) of the litter? Some other litter? I'm afraid I couldn't pay much attention to the rest of the pups I was so busy trying to figure that one out.


I watched the video and looked for this thing. Honestly I couldn't stop laughing when I saw, it for some reason. It was like a tribble from Star Trek creeping along the baseboards.

#12 OkieJenna

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 05:25 PM

Just wanted to add that I am a groomer and I have a "Pom" that comes in for grooming that looks more like a mini BC than anything else. The dog is about 12-15lbs and is blue merle with a blue eye. He looks nothing like a pom to me. Yes, he's neutered thank goodness.

Those Pom pups are pretty irresistable! They look like a bunch of little Furbees running around! Wasn't that what those little toys that were popular a few years ago were called? How Cute!


Jenna

#13 SoloRiver

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 05:42 PM

My first dog was a Pomeranian and she was the best dog ever. I LOVE Poms. That video was to die for.

It's not unusual for Pom breeders to have more than one litter on the ground at a time -- they only have two or three per litter, so it isn't the labor intensive undertaking it would be with Border Collies. Nothing's cuter than a Pom puppy.
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#14 DixiesDad

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 06:03 PM

Unfortunately, the mini Aussies I've seen - and admittedly, that's maybe only six or so - have ALL had temperament issues. ALL of them. Two have been shy/skittish, borderline fear aggressive and just kind of weird, and four have been outright fear AND dominance aggresive, and considerably weirder. I can only imagine what temperamental disasters might be produced by this idiotic mania for a mini BC.


You're absolutely right on temperament issues. One of the ladies in our horse club has started breeding mini-aussies. Needless to say she's not happy that I told her I disagreed with the practice. When asked why I pointed to her stud which she had with her and asked her did she think they were suppose to shake the way he did? Then I pointed to Dixie who was nearby in a down, alert, watching me but relaxed. That is the way they're suppose to be I said. She has avoided me since then. I wish she'd realize what she's doing to the breed.
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#15 Sue R

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 06:10 PM

She may realize what she's doing (she'd have to unless she was deaf, dumb, and blind) but she may not care enough to do the right thing.
Sue Rayburn - Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult, but not the brightest firefly in the jar.

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#16 OurBoys

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 06:23 PM

She has avoided me since then. I wish she'd realize what she's doing to the breed.

I feel she realizes what she's doing or she wouldn't be avoiding you. I just hope she has a conscience.

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#17 Liz P

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 06:59 PM

My Mom is trying to steal one of my BCs so I went to look up Pom breeders to see about buying one for her. OMG! One wanted $5000 for her show quality pups! Is that normal? Maybe I will give her one of my "mini" (30 lbs) Border Collies when they retire!

So, how much of a stud fee do you think I could charge for my 30 lb, 17.5 inch male? :rolleyes:

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#18 Guest_SweetJordan_*

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 07:57 PM

The lady down the street from me has a mini aussie. She told me that prior to that she had a cocker spaniel, and that she wanted another small dog which is why she chose the mini aussie. After listening to her talk about the dog for a half hour and observing it, I don't think she has much "aussie" in her.

#19 HillcrestBCs

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 08:41 PM

I can't tell you how many times people have either called or e-mailed me asking if I bred Mini Border Collies. Grrrrrrrrrrr!!
I have told all of them that there is no such thing as a Mini Border Collie. I told them that you can get an 18" BC in a litter with a 21" BC. There is no telling what size a pup will be when they are 7 or 8 weeks. I have had some of my smallest puppies come out to be the biggest as adults.
I really hate this pocket pet mentality people are getting.

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#20 MrSnappy

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Posted 20 January 2008 - 09:48 PM

Everyone wants Piper, because she's so wee. I can't tell you how many people tell me if I get another small one in rescue to let them know.

I have met several very nice mini Aussies. On the whole, they seem to be somewhat nervous and don't have a lot of drive, but I've not met any with BAD temperaments, as in, none of them have been nasty. Even the ones we took from the puppymill bust - all were VERY shy but all were very sweet too.

If you want to be really grossed out ... google TOY Aussies. Blech.

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