Jump to content


Photo

EOAD and ABCA Health Foundation Research


  • Please log in to reply
33 replies to this topic

#1 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 12 December 2016 - 07:20 PM

Hi,

Just curious if there is an updated to the research the foundation is doing? Any news? Or did I miss it on the website?

Also, I'd like to ask...is there anyway the ABCA will walk back their comments on ProjectDog and their research and join them (collaborate) so we're not necessarily reinventing the wheel? Is none of their data valid?

I have no scientific education whatsoever! That's why I'm asking..

Thanks!
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#2 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 12 December 2016 - 09:19 PM

As far as we were told projectdog had not done much new research beyond what was published in 2012 (I think 2012). However Lohi (a co-author of the original study) did continue to research eaod in his country and your samples are adding North America genetics to the genetic data he already has collected. We are not reinventing the wheel but are joining and pushing forward work that was already beyond where projectdog was going to start.
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#3 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 12 December 2016 - 09:22 PM

Go look up the date of the publication on identifying the marker for CEA and the date when Optigen first offered the CEA test to better set your expectations on when we will have a test.
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#4 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 12 December 2016 - 09:47 PM

Thanks Mark, very informative.
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#5 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 12 December 2016 - 11:24 PM

If I understand things correctly, the genotype mapping for CEA was started in 03, and the test was available in 10. Which leads me to *assume* the marker for EOAD is still several years out. Correct?

It was my understanding that the genetics in the Lohi research were from US dogs to begin with. No?

This is the paper I was reading. However, I cannot locate a date that the study began.

http://journals.plos...al.pgen.1002898
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#6 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 13 December 2016 - 05:28 AM

The CEA test was available in 2005 and publication of the CEA genetic marker was in 2003; the results were published and peer reviewed. At that time it took at least 2 years to go from identifying the marker associated with CEA to having a test that was predictive of the genetic disease.

The testing to date has not identified the marker(s) that are associated with eaod (btw Plos is for publishing results fast with very little peer review). No one can predict when the marker for eaod will be identified. What the CEA discussion was for is to provide everyone with a sense of timing between when the marker is identified to when a test could be developed that is predictive for a dog developing eaod.

The linked article indicated that samples from Finnish dogs were used as controls. Most of the affected dogs in the linked article were North American. I do not believe those samples were made available to Lohi by Neff.

My biggest regret during these past years is how long we waited for Neff to return with the desire to do more studies on eaod (we waited because we thought he was the farthest along in the research). Early on he provided me with "his cell number"; however there were many months/years where he did not answer calls, the voice mail box was full, and emails went unanswered. He promised to share our samples with other researchers but never did so. They did not properly lable the samples from the epilepsy study making them unusable for futher studies. These are not the behavior of most researchers.
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#7 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 13 December 2016 - 08:08 AM

Thanks Mark. So, is this article basically junk? Not the article you told me to find?

Can we be updated as to how many samples from the categories requested have been submitted? How many more are needed?

Is Dr Lohi starting over?
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#8 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 13 December 2016 - 11:03 AM

I trust the data in the article (you linked the correct article); some of the conclusions presented by Neff are still up for debate (even amongst the co-authors).

 

Dr Lohi is not starting over, the data in the article (and the collaboration with Neff for the article) provided him with a starting point for the research he continued while we were waiting for Neff to re-emerge interested in continuing his study on EAOD.

 

I do not have updated numbers on samples; but providing an update to our community on sample collection is a good idea that I will bring up with the other directors of the HEF.


Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#9 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 13 December 2016 - 11:15 AM

Thank you!!
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#10 Liz P

Liz P

    optimistic realist

  • Registered Users
  • 5,234 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:somewhere inside my brain

Posted 13 December 2016 - 08:15 PM

Mark, could you please provide an address for where I can send a sample.  I have a bitch who had normal hearing but produced an EOD affected pup.  He has documented BAER tests starting at 6 weeks old and no ear infections, injuries, etc.



#11 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 13 December 2016 - 08:28 PM

https://bordercollie...ome-sequencing/
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#12 Liz P

Liz P

    optimistic realist

  • Registered Users
  • 5,234 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:somewhere inside my brain

Posted 13 December 2016 - 08:54 PM

Mark, I have seen that link but she does not fit your criteria.  I was told previously that her sample was desirable though.



#13 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 13 December 2016 - 08:57 PM

Are you saying the sire and the dam were both hearing at age 8 but a pup went deaf between 3yo and 8yo?

Deleted: my mistake
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#14 Liz P

Liz P

    optimistic realist

  • Registered Users
  • 5,234 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:somewhere inside my brain

Posted 13 December 2016 - 09:57 PM

:

  1. Dogs affected with early adult onset deafness (EAOD) who went deaf between the ages of 2 and 8.
  2. Dogs with idiopathic epilepsy who are over the age of 8 with no loss of hearing.
  3. Dogs without hearing loss or epilepsy who are over the age of 8, from lines with no known incidence of epilepsy or hearing loss.
  4. Dogs unaffected by EAOD, who were bred to dogs that did become affected with EAOD, and who produced at least 8 pups from such mating(s) (in one or more litters), all of whom reached the age of 8 with no hearing loss.

She does not fit any of those criteria.  She was bred to a male who had normal hearing last I heard (at 11 years old) and they produced and EOD affected dog.



#15 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 14 December 2016 - 05:12 AM

Select catagory 4 and enter the description above into the text box below the catagory radio buttons.
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile

#16 Sue R

Sue R

    Bark less, wag more

  • Registered Users
  • 12,804 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Bruceton Mills WV
  • Interests:Stockdogs, horses, chocolate

Posted 14 December 2016 - 09:51 AM

Deleted. 


Sue Rayburn - Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult, but not the brightest firefly in the jar.

Celt, Megan, and Dan

"When the chips are down, watch where you step."

"The happiest people don't necessarily have the best of everything. They just make the best of everything." - author unknown

#17 Eileen Stein

Eileen Stein

    Moderator

  • Administrators
  • 5,520 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Shady Side, MD, USA

Posted 15 December 2016 - 07:16 PM

Liz, I understood that your sample was from Freya, who is now deceased?  If you haven't already followed the procedure Mark suggested (or even if you have), you can mail your sample (it's a swab, right?) to me.  The last time we discussed this was in August, and I suggested that you wait until somewhat cooler weather, not wanting to run the increased risk of bacterial growth in that heat.  The researchers want 3 swabs per dog, so please send 3 if you have them.  Please include a copy of Freya's pedigree and a completed questionnaire/consent form (see attached). Please send in a padded (not plastic) envelope.  I will record your sample in the database and forward to UMN.  The same goes if the bitch you're asking about is not Freya, but one who is alive now.                

 
If you need my address, or have any questions, please PM me.  Thank you very much.
 
--Eileen
 
Attached File  HEF questionnaire&consent form 12-16.doc   29.5K   10 downloads

Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile


#18 Liz P

Liz P

    optimistic realist

  • Registered Users
  • 5,234 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:somewhere inside my brain

Posted 15 December 2016 - 08:47 PM

Yes, these samples are from Freya who has been dead for more than a year.  I can't remember how many swabs I have, but I saved them in the hopes that her DNA could help with the study some day.



#19 Journey

Journey

    Happiness is not having what you want but wanting what you have.

  • Registered Users
  • 2,668 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 25 October 2017 - 05:45 AM

Any updates as to where things stand now? Anything new? Progress?
Karen & the growing pack of spoiled mutts!
Posted Image

#20 Mark Billadeau

Mark Billadeau

    Bill Nye Wannabe

  • Registered Users
  • 3,159 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Middletown, MD
  • Interests:science, working dogs, sheep

Posted 25 October 2017 - 06:47 AM

Work is progressing and we have received an update; however it was marked confidential by the researchers and we have not heard back from them on our request on what we can divulge.

What everyone wants to know is has a correlation been found between one gene and eaod? Not yet

When this correlation is found we still will not have a proven test for eaod. Unlike what another group indicated, finding a gene that is correlated to eaod does not prove that gene is predictive of a dog developing eaod. We won't have a test like the one for CEA.


Extensive testing of that gene will need to be performed to prove it is predictive of dogs developing eaod (like what was done for CEA). Since it takes years for dogs to develop eaod (unlike CEA) we will want an extensive data base of samples (that were not included in the gene identification work) and the hearing status of those dogs at 8years or older so we can take years off of the test validation study. We don't want to wait years for those dogs being used to validate a possible test to reach an age where the eaod status is known.
Support the ABCA Health & Education Foundation by using Amazon Smile


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users

Copyright: All posts and images on this site are protected by copyright, and may not be reproduced or distributed in any way without permission. Banner photo courtesy of Denise Wall, 2009 CDWall. For further information, contact info@bordercollie.org.