Conner22 Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 My 2.5 yr old border collie loves to annoy other dogs. I say love, but he doesn't look happy when he does it, but he won't stop. He literally 'bothers a dog til he gets a reaction, apologizes, then starts the behavior again. Following right on another dogs heels, circling dogs, pacing around dogs, sitting on dogs, accidently pushing his rear against dogs sides, etc. Its almost obsessive compulsive. I can request he stop, but he will go back to it the instant he has the chance. I can redirect, seperate, reward, calm, but it will not stop the behaviors. He doesnt do it 24/7, but probably once/twice a day for 20 min. What is this behavior called, how do you fix it, where do you look up info on it?! Is it sibling rivalry? Boredom? Agnst? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 It's called obsessiveness, and some day it's liable to end him up in a dog fight. Forgive me for asking, but have you tried just plain correcting him, giving him a firm NO, making him stop and letting him know he's screwed up? This will probably get me egged, but I sometimes see people speak of redirecting or calming or whatever a dog's bad behavior, when in some cases, I think all a misbehaving dog may need is a newspaper whacked across his rump and a big NO. Someone near and dear to me has a (neutered) border collie boy who absolutely obsesses on my intact boy, Nick. She scolds her dog, runs him off, tells him to stop doing it, and he (briefly) does. But she's never stopped the behavior. She's never made it so that the self-rewarding nature of the dog's actions are totally overwhelmed by the unpleasantness he should meet with, from her, every time he does it. As a result, we have to watch these two when they're in proximity, because sooner or later, my boy has enough and there's a scrap. MAKE your boy stop. That behavior truly is self-rewarding and even self-hypnotizing, because it is obsessive. Seriously, if this were my dog, I would consider a whack with a newspaper, or a sharp CLACKETY-CLACK from a plastic bottle of pebbles every time he does it, until it dawns on him that you simply will not stand for it. Yes, corporal punishment sounds harsh, but a calculated, well-timed, genuine correction will not break your dog's spirit. And since I have to deal with a dog who does something similar, and the owner does not fix it, I have little patience for it in other dogs. Waiting for the eggs to start flying, now ... Respectfully submitted, Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geonni banner Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I dunno about throwing eggs. I'd be happy to fix you an omelette tho'. Your advice is right effing on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Omelettes, mmmm. Perfect on a chilly October day! Dang, now I'm hungry. ~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conner22 Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Yes. I have tried "NO" but I have not swatted his butt yet. Will try it. If I threw a bottle of change it would punish EVERYONE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaBluez Tess Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I havd had people's dogs that do that and it annoys me...one tried the clicker route and it didn't do any good. Once, many years ago, when Shiro was younger, a dog did that to her at the dog park. She turned around and whupped it good...as they say. The owner went batshit crazy and I told her that I warned her that her dog first bit my dog and feel free to call the police as it was self defense. That dog never approached Shiro again. I don't let any of my students dogs do that here and if my dogs do it, they get a good correction. Now, I just give them a warning look and it stops. There are some things that clicker training is good for but not in this case. The dog has to learn NOW that this is unacceptable. What if the dog nips a huge dog, then a bad fight may occur and severe injuries. Best to nip tis in the bud (no pun intended) than let it be an issue later. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conner22 Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Delta blues: he doesn't nip, at all. He obsessively annoys. Like if your little brother kept poking your arm and saying your name. I will try physical correction, since I've tried just about everything else. I've pushed him from other dogs personal space, walked him out of room, kennelled him, redirected with training, yelled, shut doors, long down stays......its not fixed it. If anything he gets more obsessive after a correction or redirection. But its not all day, more occasionally. But trying to get him 'out of the mood' is difficult when after starts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geonni banner Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 My 2.5 yr old border collie loves to annoy other dogs. I say love, but he doesn't look happy when he does it, but he won't stop. He literally 'bothers a dog til he gets a reaction, apologizes, then starts the behavior again. Following right on another dogs heels, circling dogs, pacing around dogs, sitting on dogs, accidently pushing his rear against dogs sides, etc. Its almost obsessive compulsive. I can request he stop, but he will go back to it the instant he has the chance. I can redirect, seperate, reward, calm, but it will not stop the behaviors. He doesnt do it 24/7, but probably once/twice a day for 20 min. What is this behavior called, how do you fix it, where do you look up info on it?! Is it sibling rivalry? Boredom? Agnst? From your post I think that your dog is just being a jerk. Being a jerk to a well-mannered dog rarely has any consequences, so you need to supply them. Otherwise, when he tries it with a non-well-mannered dog he may get his face ripped off. I had a Doberman that thought that sort of thing was funny for awhile too. A good crack across the but and an instant frogmarch to the bathroom, or the car, if we were out somewhere, (getting the door slammed in her face either way,) put a stop to that behavior pretty quick. Doing it the "nice" way simply doesn't supply a deterrent stronger that the payoff of butt-bumping another dog. If you fool around with the "nice" method you may or may not get the the job done before you dog gets clobbered by a surly Labrador Retriever, German Shepherd Dog, Pit Bull or just about any adult female dog. And that may involve stitches, litigation and who knows what else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideon's girl Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I've had one just like that and the only thing that worked was for me to suddenly get up and stomp over, grab collar, and throw him in his crate. After such a big production, he knew a stomped foot would be followed by extreme unpleasantness, so if I stomped my foot he would scatter away from what he was doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted October 23, 2012 Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 I agree with the other replies. As well, see if you can observe him closely. He probably sends off some subtle movements or attitude changes that signal he's about to be an a**hole. Interrupt then, don't wait for the full on jerkitude to start. There is an art to correction, I believe. If you can get your dog to believe that you know when he's just thinking about being a jerk, and that you won't stand for even one little bit of bad behavior, your process will be much quicker. So don't let him pester other dogs AT ALL EVER. Interrupt/correct EVERY TIME. Swift, clear, consistent. Good luck and let us know how you get on. Ruth and Agent Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conner22 Posted October 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 23, 2012 Thanks to all replies! I'm ready to implement! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaBluez Tess Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 nipping or not nipping, either way it is getting into the other dog's space and can lead to a fight. If my little brother kept poking mmy arm and saying my name, i would put up with for a bit, then smack his ass. But my bro wold see my signal well before I smack him. I suggest stopping the behavior before something occurs that made not be pleasant. My name is Diane not deltablues as it is in my signature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejano Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 My 2.5 yr old border collie loves to annoy other dogs. I say love, but he doesn't look happy when he does it, but he won't stop. He literally 'bothers a dog til he gets a reaction, apologizes, then starts the behavior again. Following right on another dogs heels, circling dogs, pacing around dogs, sitting on dogs, accidently pushing his rear against dogs sides, etc. Its almost obsessive compulsive. I can request he stop, but he will go back to it the instant he has the chance. I can redirect, seperate, reward, calm, but it will not stop the behaviors. He doesnt do it 24/7, but probably once/twice a day for 20 min. What is this behavior called, how do you fix it, where do you look up info on it?! Is it sibling rivalry? Boredom? Agnst? I agree with Gloria et al - put the fear of doG in him. It will stop. Robin was a pushy bully with Brodie when they were 6-10 months old - part of it might have been a working reflex kicking in, part hormones and part just plain domination - he was a very pushy pup right from the start and today he's a very hard eyed, pushy dog. But he's also respectful of me and other dogs now. One day I caught him coming around the fir trees out of what we called the puppy "clubhouse" ( a barrel with both sides cut out) hot on Brodie's heels and scared the bejasus out of him. I didn't need to smack him, I just ran at him like a maniac yelling WHAT DO YOU THINK YOU'RE DOING! in my most growley voice. It stopped him dead in his tracks and he hit the ground like he did as a young pup in the litter when he knew his mother was after him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 And there you have it. I love my dogs. I spoil my dogs. They are all lying on the warm carpet around my chair as I type this, and they eat in our cozy kitchen. But a little well-timed corporal punishment, (or sometimes just a good bellow) fairly administered, in some situations can work wonders. Think of it this way. If your boy tried that with his mama dog, she'd probably pin him to the floor and threaten to knock his block off! Best of luck. It won't change overnight, but with consistency and good timing, you may begin to see change sooner than you think. When that happens, you'll be able to correct him with nothing more than a growl. Success! ~ Gloria P.S. The hardest thing to remember may be - do not apologize or make up to your dog right after the correction. He may look at you all startled and hurt, but just tell him quietly, "That will do," and walk him away from the situation. You can make up to him later, when he's being good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mbc1963 Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Gloria is right. With 100% effectiveness, Buddy has taught several dogs to stay out of his face. He flips them over, stands over them for about 30 seconds, stares in their eyes, and growls at them. I had to let Buddy do this to the pushier of my sister's two 7-month-old pups, because she just wouldn't learn. I let her get old enough to take the lesson, and then my sister and I took a walk with the dogs off-leash. When Yuki got up in his face, Buddy did his thing. Yuki screamed the whole time as if she were being eviscerated, but then all was well. And she hasn't gotten too close to Buddy since then, although she worships him and wants nothing more than to get at him and kiss his face. I've often thought I could rent my dog out to owners of pushy dogs, as a sort of "Super Nanny" to show them what's what. Alas, it doesn't seem to be transferrable - dogs learn that Buddy is not to be trifled with, but they don't learn a general lesson unless other dogs snap at them too. Mary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Root Beer Posted October 24, 2012 Report Share Posted October 24, 2012 Hi Conner22 - I sent you quite a long PM about this, so be sure to check your inbox for it. Hope something in it proves helpful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conner22 Posted October 25, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Hooooray! So far so awesome. I seriously just swat his butt, say "no" and send him away. Like magic! He just calms down and quits!!!! Thanks all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schaferhunde AKA Sheepdog Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Omelettes, mmmm. Perfect on a chilly October day! Dang, now I'm hungry. ~ Gloria Omelettes sound good Though it's not cold it's 20+ Degree's more then our normal averagre... Lol I'm away off topic! I don't have thing more to say,there's many other good answers posted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted October 25, 2012 Report Share Posted October 25, 2012 Hooooray! So far so awesome. I seriously just swat his butt, say "no" and send him away. Like magic! He just calms down and quits!!!! Thanks all! Sometimes they just need the "mama dog" to give a growl and a snap, to set them on the right path. Glad to hear he's showing improvement. Finding a calm, collected state of mind is probably a relief to him! ~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCjetta Posted October 26, 2012 Report Share Posted October 26, 2012 My young one harasses my old one all the time if I let her...but it seems to be a sucky type thing. She won't do it to the aussie who acts like he's the boss and will also play with her, but she pesters the old female who just wants to be left alone (and who is the real boss). She comes up and crawls up to her and licks at her face, or rolls over and paws at her face. I don't quite get what she's trying to accomplish by doing this aside from potentially getting bitten on the face like she has 3 times. I tell her to leave Hannah alone whenever I catch her coming in to pester and she will go away, but may come back 10 minutes later and try again. Do you think this is a being obnoxious behaviour or her trying to get the older dog to like her or something to that effect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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