dlwharleyman Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 We purchased a puppy in December that was advertised as being a BC. In looking on the Internet, the dog looks like a breed called a McNab. Are McNabs another type of BC or a completely different breed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Where do you live? If you're in Northern CA, then there's a chance that you got a dog that has some Mc Nabb in him/her. McNabbs were developed not far from where I live. They tend to have a broader chest/shoulders than a BC. If your dog has a short coat and prick ears, it could be all BC, or if the chest is broad rather than narrow, part McNabb. McNabbs were 'made' from border collie stock and something else that I can't remember right now. Gotta dash, check those pix of McNabbs and look at their chests/shoulders. You can also google 'smooth coat border collie' and you'll what those dog look like. Either way, your pup is likely to be a great dog that needs to be part of a team with its humans. Ruth and Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I'm not sure what you mean by a "standard" border (note spelling) collie, as there's really no such thing. Historically they're primarily working dogs though unfortunately in the past 20-30 years they've been being bred for different things, which actually makes the idea of any sort of universal standard even less applicable. McNabs and border collies are very similar, related breeds from what's probably common ancestry, although McNabs are an American breed while border collies originated in the border country between Scotland and England. Neither on was originally bred for appearance and working bred border collies still aren't, so there's a lot of variation within each breed and a lot of overlap in appearance. Some people refer to McNabs as McNab border collies, which only adds to the confusion. If your dog was advertised as a border collie and the breeder was at least reasonably responsible, then I suspect it probably is. If you have registration papers or the parent do, I'd be even more inclined to think so. McNabs aren't widely known outside of a particular area in the western US, though they are being found in other areas once in a while. Border collies OTOH are pretty ubiquitous around the US, so that alone makes it a more likely choice in most areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denice Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I havenot done any research to prove or disprove what is written here but here you go http://specialcollies.com/Collie%20Origins.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Wikipedia has an article about McNabs, it does say that the article needs more verification. You can google McNab dog origin and one of the choices will be the Wikipedia article. I'm unable to provide a link, something about the BC Boards won't let me. Anyway, the article confirms what I wrote earlier - a rancher named McNab bred border collies to Basque herding dogs in the 19th century. McNab owned a 10,000 acre ranch in Mendocino County, CA. I live about an hour and a half from Mendocino Cty. That's why I asked where you live - if you live in Northern CA, it could be a McNab. Anywhere else, much less likely. Ruth and Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnLloydJones Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I've known a couple of dogs that came into rescue who were believed to be McNabbs. Visually, they were not readily distinguishable from a border collie, but they did have a different style of movement. I don't know if this is actually a distinguishing characteristic as they were both (presumed natural) bob tails. Both were tremendous dogs and very smart and biddable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diane allen Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 Why can't we post links here? Some folks seem able - and I think this works! I just saw this article - certainly validates much of the "I don't know what breed of dog this is." https://animalfarmfoundation.wordpress.com/2016/02/08/breed-labels-when-guesses-turn-into-predictions/ If that doesn't work as a link, google it or try otherwise. It is a MOST interesting and informative article about "crossbreeds." diane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 We purchased a puppy in December that was advertised as being a BC. In looking on the Internet, the dog looks like a breed called a McNab. Are McNabs another type of BC or a completely different breed? In a nutshell, if it's registered with the ABCA, it's a border collie. If it's not, lord knows. But McNabs were a created breed developed from the border collie, that has no registry of its own. They are not super common and are mainly found in northern California. Here's a bit about their development by rancher Alexander McNab in the 1880s. http://www.bordercolliemuseum.org/BCCousins/TheMcNab/McNab.html McNabs can come in any number of guises, mostly smooth coat but I know of at least one with a light rough coat, and some are seen with long tails, some with docked tails and most with pointed ears - but not always. Here's a Bing search gallery of McNab pictures: https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=McNab+dog&FORM=HDRSC2 But if the puppy was advertised as a BC, appearance alone is no reason to think it's not a BC - because BCs come in far more shapes and sizes than McNabs - including pointy ears and smooth coats. Got any photos of your little one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 Diane, most folks seem to be able to post links. There are a few of us who can't. It's been this way for me for a couple years, I think. Ruth and Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chene Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 Diane, most folks seem to be able to post links. There are a few of us who can't. It's been this way for me for a couple years, I think. Ruth and Gibbs What internet browser do you use? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 I use Internet Explorer, and am not interested in loading and getting used to a new browser. Someone suggested Firefox, and I tried that a while ago - it was awful. A couple technically in-the-know folks I know have also advised against using Firefox. Ruth and Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 My technically-in-the-know go to person (a programmer) highly recommends Firefox and despises IE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urge to herd Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 IE has worked for me for years with very few exceptions - and those exceptions turned out to be at least related to operator error. My experience w/Firefox was worse than awful - I still get a little queasy just thinking about it. It's a lot to do with comfort levels and an aversive effect. A very good friend loves and swears by Firefox, but I can't get past the sick feeling in my stomach! Thanks, all, for taking the time to chat about the nature of browsers and inadvertent application of aversive therapy! Ruth and Gibbs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PSmitty Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 What makes you think that? Do you have pics? We love puppy pics! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chene Posted February 17, 2016 Report Share Posted February 17, 2016 I use Internet Explorer, and am not interested in loading and getting used to a new browser. Someone suggested Firefox, and I tried that a while ago - it was awful. A couple technically in-the-know folks I know have also advised against using Firefox. Ruth and Gibbs I just checked on IE (I don't usually use it, I too despise it) and I wasn't able to post links, paste anything, or quote anyone. I'm not a fan of Firefox either, every tech savvy person I know uses Google Chrome. Not too much difference in the layout from IE. You could always download it or Firefox and use IE most of the time but switch browsers if you need to do certain things on the forum. Or you could try downloading an old version of IE that's compatible with the forum. Or live without those things, of course, which seems to have worked out alright for you anyways. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeanne Joy Posted February 18, 2016 Report Share Posted February 18, 2016 This link about McNabs may be of interest to some of you: https://stockdogsavvy.wordpress.com/2010/02/06/mcnab/ and this one: https://stockdogsavvy.wordpress.com/2010/02/06/mcnab/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dlwharleyman Posted February 19, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2016 WOW! Thank you all for your responses. Geographically I do live in Northern California in the town of Grass Valley. The dog came from a ranch somewhere North of Dixon, which is on Interstate 80. I purchased the dog off of Craig's List as a present for a friend. The seller showed pictures of her male and female BC's on Craigs List and said the male apparently had mated with the female just before he was fixed, so she ended up with seven pups. From all of these posts, I gather that the pup could be McNab, BC or a mix, so I'll just refer to him as a BC.Thank you all again for your posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alfreda Posted March 6, 2016 Report Share Posted March 6, 2016 http://www.ukiahdailyjournal.com/general-news/20160305/meet-ukiahs-craft-canine-the-mcnab-shepherd Here's a pretty cool article on McNabs.... there's also a public FB group for McNabs... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibetus99 Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 Hello, I have the same issue with the fellow dog owner. I recently got Odin as he was published as a border collie but as time passed and I investigated more, I started to think it’s a McNab. Maybe I can send a picture and you guys can help me out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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