Blue eyed puppy -- how??

[minihorse]

I am interested in anyone who can help me understand the genetics of this. The sire and dam of my litter of pups are both brown eyed. Both of their parents were brown eyed (i saw them both) Noah's sire was however a red dog. I have one puppy in this litter who has a startling blue eye. HOw is that possible?? Is it a trait that came from the red grandsire? This is what a friend told me but I have never read that red is indicative of blue eyes only merles? I have always read in humans and horses blue eyes are a recessive trait so you cannot get blue eyes unless a parent has blue eyes. Im really confused here.

 

Thanks

Kay

[Sue R]

I know that others, like Melanie, will know more about this than I will but, with humans, blue eyes are recessive. You can have two brown-eyed (but heterozygous) parents with a blue-eyed (homozygous) child as they can each "give" a blue-eye gene to the child.

 

However, a person with two recessive blue-eyed genes can only give a blue-eyed gene to his/her offspring. Whether or not that offspring has blue eyes will then depend on what color gene the other parent contributes.

 

Whether or not dog eye color dominance/recessiveness is the same, I do not know but it wouldn't surprise me.

[Betsy]

Very interesting. I know this is off-topic (kinda) but can you explain the human part a little more? I'm asking because I'm 7 months pregnant and am wondering what my little baby girl is going to look like.

 

I have blond hair and blue eyes, as does everyone in my immediate family, and practically all of my extended family.

 

My husband on the other hand, has brown hair and brown eyes, as does everyone in his immediate family (except maybe his dad? I can't remember for sure). His extended family has lots of brown/brown, but does have some blond/blue.

 

What are my chances for a little towhead (blond haired) running around with blue eyes?

 

I've always wanted a little blue-eyed, blond-haired little girl!!

 

[Deanna in OR]

I don't know the genetics of eye color in herding dogs, but I have seen black-and-white Border Collies with 1 or 2 blue eyes.

 

I think it's more complicated than just "dominant or recessive", perhaps multiple genes at work on eye color. The reason I say this is that Tenaya (a blue merle) has her right eye that is predominantly blue, but the upper 20% is brown; and her left eye is brown, but there is a small area of blue near the bottom.

Her father had one blue and one brown eye (also a blue merle) but I don't know if the colors were mixed within an eye. I've seen other dogs, including collies, with this same kind of eye coloring.

 

Perhaps this is a combination of eye color and the merle gene that causes the mixed-color-in-one-eye? does that happen only in merles? Anyone out there who knows about eye color genetics?

 

Deanna in OR

[jvw]

My pup's grand-dam has part blue in one of her eyes. She is not a merle. She is black and white smoothe coat.

[sea4th]

I don't know the genetics of eye color, but my Pete dog, a saddle-backed tri has one blue and and the other is half brown & half blue.

 

http://www.dogster.com/?18267

 

There are no close ups of his eyes on this dogster link, but his color is obviously not a merle.

 

Vicki

 

P.S. His eyes sort of glow red in dim light.

[SoloRiver]

Eye color in humans is controlled by multiple genes. The brown/blue thing is not a simple dominant/recessive. Blue-eyed parents can and often do have brown-eyed children.

 

I don't know anything in particular about the genetics of human eye color inheritance, but I have noticed that children often seem to have an eye color between that of their parents rather than an either/or (i.e., blue-eyed dad plus brown-eyed mom equals kids with light brown or hazel eyes) and I also know how to use Google.

[BigD]

Oh, oh...this was my FAVORTIE topic in HS biology.

 

Let's see if I can get it right - it's been a LONG time.

 

We each carry 2 genes for eye color. The dominant and recessive gene. Blue is the most recessive gene. Black/Brown is the most dominant gene. In the middle are the hazel and green eyed monsters. (me!)

 

So let's say you have blue eyes...that means BOTH your genes are the blue gene. If your parents have brown eyes, that means that both their recessive genes are blue OR your mom had fun with the mail man.

 

Betsy wants a blue eyed baby. She's off to a very good start by having blue eyes her self, BUT she married a man with brown eyes and that could very well mean she's going to have a brown eyed baby. You see, her husband would HAVE to have the recessive blue eye gene. And even if he did, it's not good odds that she will get it. (seeing that the rest of his family are all browns)

 

Of course, the husband could have green as his recessive gene and the baby could end up with green eyes as green is more dominant than blue.

 

Does this make any sense? God it was a lot easier in biology!

 

As for dogs...it may be different as I've never seen a dog with hazel or green eyes. So I'm assuming that you've got the brown/black and blue and that's it. My assumption is that the dominant and recessive gene thing still applies. If you breed to blue eyed dogs will you ALWAYS get blue eyed pups? I'm not sure. But from what I remember, this COULD be the case in humans. But there is a LOT more to it.

 

Hope this helps...

 

Denise

[minihorse]

Deanna what odd but beautiful eyes your dog has! Im just really stumped about where this blue eye came from. I do have a horse friend who is very well versed in color genetics so I sent her an email and will see what she says. Thanks for all your help anyway. I really thought when he was younger it was just puppy blue but its now apparent this is a true blue eye. It came out red in the picture on my website.

 

Just for comparison. I am blue eyed and so is my husband. We have three children. two have blond hair and blue eyes and one has dark hair and brown eyes. Im kinda odd as Im very dark skinned and dark hair with blue eyes.

[Deanna in OR]

Eye genetics must be fairly complex in dogs. There are a wide range of "brown" colors, for example. I've seen some border collies with the most incredibly beautiful amber-colored eyes, too...technically "brown", but very different from deep dark brown eyes like many other border collies have.

 

Deanna in OR

[MrSnappy]

Originally posted by BigD:

I've never seen a dog with hazel or green eyes.

My red tri male had green eyes until he was almost 8 months old, upon which they changed to amber/yellow.

 

I did meet a pitbull with green eyes; the dog was an adult. But I don't see it very often.

 

Blue eyes show up all over the place in BCs, sometimes the parents have them, sometimes they don't. I don't know the genetics of it, but I don't think it's a big mystery. Blue eyes are not uncommon in the breed.

 

RDM

[minihorse]

I knew blue eyes were common in border collies especially merles. Misty my merle has one blue eye but her sire was merle with blue eyes so no guessing there. Just baffles me that with so many known generations of brown eyes a blue eye appeared. Maybe my other friend was right and the blue eye came from the red grandsire? Still waiting to hear from my genetics friend.

[MrSnappy]

Originally posted by minihorse:

Maybe my other friend was right and the blue eye came from the red grandsire? Still waiting to hear from my genetics friend.

Why would the blue eye have to come from the red dog? It's actually much less common to see a blue eyed red and white than it is to see a blue eyed black and white (red merles excepted). It's just as likely to have been carried from any one of the black and white relatives. Most of the red dogs I know have pale amber eyes, although I have seen a few with blue eyes.

 

RDM

[minihorse]

RDM

 

I am not at all familiar with red border collies. My friend who breeds aussies had said blue eyes were more common in red dogs. Maybe she is wrong?? I dont know---that is why I posted this on the genetics board to see if anyone else knew. Since I have seen the parents of both my dogs and know that I have two generations of brown eyes on both sides it does seem odd to have a blue eyed puppy. I guess it doesnt matter -- I am just kinda fascinated with genetics and thought it was okay to post this question here.

[BigD]

RDM:

My red tri male had green eyes until he was almost 8 months old, upon which they changed to amber/yellow.

 

I did meet a pitbull with green eyes; the dog was an adult. But I don't see it very often.

Yes, that's why I said the eye color genetics must be different in dogs since the blue is the most recessive in humans, but much more common than green in dogs.

 

Denise