Border collies vs shelties

[Laurelin]

Does anyone have both (or have had both in the past)? I'm just kind of curious as to how they compare. I'm wanting a more outgoing dog than my shelties are for my next dog (and a bit bigger). I've heard various things about BC temperament in comparison. one of my shelties is really really shy and I'd really like to avoid that in my next dog. My other sheltie is a very atypical girl who rushes up to greet people with her tail wagging. (Must never have read up on shelties). Both bark like crazy of course. Both of them are fairly lazy and I'd like something more active as well.

 

Any kind of comparison would be fantastic.

 

Sorry to bombard everyone with posts, lol.

[Rebecca, Irena Farm]

Hi!

 

I've been away at a clinic so I missed your other posts. As far as shyness goes, check out the thread on the guy who wants to breed his shy dog. You'll see why we particularly discourage people from breeding shy Border Collies. It certainly happens, and happens a lot, but I tell people to go to trials and meet dogs while looking for a pup.

 

Trials are especially good because not only does a dog have to handle the fuss and bother of travel and meeting lots of people and dogs, but these dogs also have to deal with the stress of training to that level (open trials) and working the course that day. People of course can protect a dog with a poor temperament, and do, but they are not the ones sitting under the tent with their dogs quietly waiting their turns - off leash.

 

I tell people to go, find out about the trials, talk to people about their dogs. The ice breaking question is, "Are you running him/her today?" and the next question if the answer is "no" (as the dog might be young or old) is "Are you running a dog today?"

 

Watch for the dogs that run in a relaxed way and seem happy with what they are doing out there. These won't be the world beaters at sports most likely, but the more tense dogs take more work to be livable in a pet setting. But, the majority of open dogs are there because they have a good balance between desire to work, instincts, natural impulse control, and the ability to work well with a handler.

 

We've talked about this before, but I'll mention it for the sake of lurkers - get to know the heart of the breed before getting a pup and it will be much easier to get a pup that you will be happy with. Plus, you'll have lots of support from within the breed, from your breeder, friends of your breeder, people who have littermates or relatives of the parents - it's like an extended family if you do your homework before making a final decision.

 

Welcome to the dark side, by the way!

 

Ooops. Forgot to talk about Shelties. The Shelties I've seen have displayed much more of a "what's in it for me" attitude than any collie breed I have experience with, including Border Collies. I imagine that goes back to the spitz-ish origins of the breed. The quirks that Shelties have, you also can get in a Border Collie, but magnified many times over. For instance, Shelties can be sharp-shy and I understand reactivity is a bit of a problem in the breed. But, when Border Collies are fear aggressive, they combine the problem with hair trigger reaction times and extreme athleticism. If a Border Collies gets a notion to bite, they will more often than not, land that bite.

 

A well bred Border Collie, raised right, tends to be quieter all around, less naturally jumpy and more deliberate (more thoughtful than reactive). But, of course, they have more of a need to get cues from you about what the day's events will be. If not, they will try to manipulate you into creating a routine for them (like 24/7 ball playing). That's actually not a good thing to do - it's far better to have a training and playing/recreation schedule and then teach your dog to chill the rest of the time.

[FoxgloveBC]

I own both a Sheltie and a BC. Here's just my experiences with both of them.

 

I found out that my Sheltie is a lot more reactive to things than the BC. He tends to get scared of things a lot more, such as music, bikes, kids, etc. He was socialized like crazy when he was a puppy and has gone all over the place with me. He just wont stop barking at strangers and such. My BC however, just loves everyone and has this attitude of "what next?" The Sheltie can sometimes blow me off though.

 

At first, I thought the Sheltie was more for me, but when I got my BC I really know that the BC is really the dog for me. My BC is not as soft and timid as the Sheltie, she likes learning with the clicker a lot more, she wants to do more. My Sheltie is a lot more simple minded with: agility, agility, agility...anything else and he could care less. Foxy likes learning everything. The BC is my do everything dog, shes so intense and shes a lot of fun.

 

I love my Sheltie to death and hes an awesome agility dog, but a bit too much on the reactive and soft side for me.

 

Yes BCs are a challenge and you need to spend a lot of time socializing and they take a lot of work (especially if you get a puppy) but the bond you get and how much fun they are is worth every second... it is amazing what level these dogs are on and you have no idea about it until you own one.

[Ruger's Dad]

We used to have a Sheltie. His name was Chump, I mean Chip. He was basically a do nothing dog. Trying to compare the two is like comparing night and day. Ruger is unique. I can see how these guys end up being the right hand man and constant companion of ranchers. At this point, I would simply never consider any other dog.

[Greylite]

My Sheltie was yappy, clingly, motion sensitive, loyal, loving and always near but never underfoot. She'd sit off in the distance and watch you. When you'd go to move she'd follow along. She liked to have you in eyesight but she wasn't overly personal. She never wanted cuddles but if you were upset she'd be the first to come and sit by you to let you know you were not alone. She was an even tempered girl with a heart of gold. Tolerated anything and everything you could possibly think of. That is just one dog of the breed though. A poorly bred one at that.

 

My boys are different in nearly every way. Spanky is happy-go-lucky, quick as a whip to respond to a command, loves training, but is easily distracted. He is over stimulated easily. He loves everyone. Bandit is a one person dog. He is much more like my Sheltie. Always near, never underfoot. He is a very mature man. Both my Border Collies have a lot of drive. They both love human contact (Bandit only with me). Both are freakishly smart, active, loyal dogs with weird little quirks.

 

I would own both breeds again. Shelties aren't like Border Collies at all from what I've noticed. I can't think of a dog I have ever met that can compare itself even some what to the BCs. They are on their own little planet. Both my Sheltie and my Border Collies would give you all they had without hesitation. Both wanted to do you right. They just go about it in two totally different ways.

[theshine]

Hey chick, I know you! I already told you a little about mine, but I'll repeat in case I missed anything. Shiner is my up for anything dog. Anything at all, as long as I'm with him, he's good for it. Walk, nap, ride, play, cuddle, train. He's eternally happy. He is actually more shy than my shelties, not painfully shy, but he won't aproach strangers. He's less reactive (not reactive at all actually) and barks much, much less, which has been nice. Another nice thing is the slightly lower maintainance coat, but still huggable. Negatives, I literally trip over him sometimes, he's glued to my side, he stares at me (more a quirk than a negative). He's also a big chewer and needs alot more management and dog proofing than the shelties. If you're looking for a dog a little more active and interactive than shelties, I think you'll be pleased with a bc.

 

As far as my shelties go, they're very different from eachother, each seems to have a couple positives and a couple negatives of the breed, but not the same ones. Ripley likes to cuddle and is crazy smart and biddable, but he's also my big barker, he's leash reactive, and he's a couch potato. Frosty is my active guy, loves fetch, barks only moderately, not reactive, but he is not affectionate, can be stubborn with training, and is very soft. Both have been incredibly easy to live with as far as house manners, they don't chew, don't get into anything, stay nearby but not up my arse.

[kate40541]

This is based on observations of a limited (to SW Florida) area but the sheltie people I've seen around agility and obedience clubs/classes/trials all know each other and hang out together only needing the shared breed to have something in common. BC owners in contrast are mostly loners, without the need? desire? to hang out with other people who belong to border collies. Has anyone else noticed this?

 

I used to have people tell me their dog didn't like border collies meaning the dogs didn't like the 'stare' as the BC watched whatever was going on but I never had a sheltie owner tell me this. The shelties I've known don't seem to care what another dog is doing, unless they can bark at it (and bark and bark and bark). In our area it's very common for shelties to be debarked, usually shelties come in multiples and with their reactivity if one barks all of them do.

 

Most of the shelties though are more focussed on their owner than on other people, only one has been out-going enough to be buddies with anyone who crossed his path.

 

 

Suzanne

[Laurelin]

Thanks so much everyone for the input! I feel like I already know half of you... oh wait, I do!

 

It's a small internets.

 

I love my shelties but I don't think I'll ever get another. Maybe far down the road, but even then I'm not sure. Though they're complete opposites, they're both very aloof. The paps are more my style, though they can be a little TOO into their people at times. I don't think I could find a more clingy/human needy breed.

 

My two shelties are complete opposites. Nikki is a big grouch yet at the same time much more affectionate than Trey. She's confident and though she may not like you (lol) she's not remotely scared of you. Just maybe indifferent. She's not remotely shy or timid. she's a hard headed dog taht will backtalk you. I guess that's what you get for getting a poorly bred sheltie, though.

 

Trey is just really bizarre. He's very very shy and very un-animated. I love him to death, I really do, but I can be safe in saying I never want another dog like him. His issues have been a lot of work to pull through. I can deal with mildly shy like Rose (though I think hers is more from her previous circumstances). But I'd like to avoid a dog that I have to desensitize everything constantly. In other words, I don't mind a dog that stays a distance away from newcomers but I don't want another one that hides from them.

 

ETA: Paige, I love hearing about Shelby. I'm always reminded of Nikki (though Shelby sounds nicer!) Nik's my first dog so she's a special girl.

[john G]

I'm a little confused with all I've been reading in this thread about Shelties. Clearly there is a lot of variability amongst dogs individually. My sheltie was the most loving and intelligent dog I've ever known. At times, she was hyper, at times she would chill, but she was always this saintly dog that would never get snappy with anyone. I almost do not want to get a new dog because I fear I will be disapointed. She was this amazing animal. That being said, I've also met Shelties who are really annoying chihuahua-like lap dogs. Similarly, if you go to petfinder and look at all the Border Collies put up for adoption, you see many that have behavioral issues no doubt due to improper socialization.

 

I think when you get a dog, with the proper socialization, development, and owner input, many dogs have the potential to become these amazing animals...

 

So the question is, what kind of a dog are YOU prepared to raise? Good luck....

[Greylite]

ETA: Paige, I love hearing about Shelby. I'm always reminded of Nikki (though Shelby sounds nicer!) Nik's my first dog so she's a special girl.

 

She was the sweetest, kindest, most gentle dog I have ever had the pleasure to know. Grouchy in her old age to other animals, she never once was sour with a human. She loved her people. AND KIDS! I use to take her into show and tell. No one else was aloud to bring their dogs but I was aloud to bring mine. All the teachers knew her and loved her. Even the kids who were scared poopless of dogs would come up and pat her. She'd sit in the middle in all her glory being stroked by children.

 

 

From what I've heard about Nikki she sounds a lot like Shelby. She was the poorly bred Sheltie right? Shelby was too.

[Laurelin]

She was the sweetest, kindest, most gentle dog I have ever had the pleasure to know. Grouchy in her old age to other animals, she never once was sour with a human. She loved her people. AND KIDS! I use to take her into show and tell. No one else was aloud to bring their dogs but I was aloud to bring mine. All the teachers knew her and loved her. Even the kids who were scared poopless of dogs would come up and pat her. She'd sit in the middle in all her glory being stroked by children.

From what I've heard about Nikki she sounds a lot like Shelby. She was the poorly bred Sheltie right? Shelby was too.

 

Yep, I got her from a less than reputable breeder when I was 9.

 

Though, Nik is grouchy. she is all talk, though. And she loves kids. she always has. Kids could do anything to her and she could care less.