tucker09 Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 I bought an ABCA registered black and white female Border Collie from a breeder a bit over 2 months ago.. she is 4 1/2 months old now. She is fantastic; insanely intelligent, sweet, quirky, energetic, etc. I am so happy with everything about her. My only worry at this time is that I have yet to see her display any real form of herding behavior, no crouch or anything like that - I have horses, cats, and goats that she is around daily. I can say that I have seen her start to get an "eye" a few times on occasions NOT related to stock. Everything about her says that she should be a working dog.. She is from working parents and lines, well bred.. I bought her specifically for the hope to use her on stock. I know it is still early and she is quite young, and I don't think that it would really even be bothering me at all expect for the fact that she is my 2nd Border Collie, I have a 4 year old ABCA reg. male from working parents and great lines who when I brought him home at 8 weeks old and set him on the ground and he saw a horse - he immediately got into the crouch. To this day he remains an exceptionally instinctual, savvy, natural herder. He has always had a very strong desire to work. So because I saw him launch into his instincts so young... it just has me a little concerned that she hasn't! I don't know what the "general" rule of thumb for herding behavior is, or if there even is any usual timeline. What I'm really looking for is some reassurance! Is this normal? Common, even? After all, she is still just a baby. I don't know if she is the weird one, or my male was! Thanks for any help! Andrea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debbie Meier Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 Some don't come around to it until they are older, it's actually kinda nice because you don't have to worry about them finding trouble like the early starters. Some lines are known to be earlier starters and some late, you may want to contact her breeder and inquire as to what is normal for the dogs out of their lines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEC Posted December 3, 2013 Report Share Posted December 3, 2013 Four and one-half months is young to know the style and/or instinct she will eventually have. Some show a head-down, eyes-fixed crouch (stylish work) early, some later, and others never demonstrate it. Many border collies work upright. My understanding is that the parents' working style provides no guarantee for their off-spring, yet having working parents certainly raises the probabilities that she will have necessary instincts to properly move stock. Numerous excellent border collie stockdogs do not work in a crouch, yet place/win in open trials. I realize that many handlers want a stylish dog, but suggest discussing it with professionals, and I believe that even assuming she finally works upright (too early to say), you might learn to appreciate/understand it. The strong-eyed, stalking look in some BCs has the ability, through no fault of their own, to send some high-strung sheep, in short order, into neighboring counties . OTOH, upright, medium-eyed BC's may be just right for such a job. It's a balancing act. In my experience, extremely stylish BCs (low-shoulder crouch) have some potential to be sticky, or hard to get on their feet from a down when confronted with stroppy sheep. Likewise, upright, loose-eyed dogs are often believed (IMO wrongly) to have insufficient power when the chips are down. Probably depends largely on the early training they were given to compensate for natural traits. Hey, I took my dog at about 6-7 months to an inexperienced trainer who just stood there in a round-pen with immobile docile sheep. She was on a line, away from home around a lot a strangers, and it was hot. Nothing happened. Trainer said, "Sorry," with no further suggestions. I was pretty sure that was not the final story. New coach and short time later, she was doing a fine job. An upright worker, at eight years she shows enough power and plenty of instinct, doing everything I ask of her. Every dog is somewhat unique. Hope the above helps a little. Give it some time, and then have an experienced trainer take a look to advise how to best train her particular personality. There are members here who have trained and bred a good number of dogs, and will have lots of good advice. -- Best wishes, TEC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted December 4, 2013 Report Share Posted December 4, 2013 At 4.5 months, she's just a puppy, so just let her be a puppy. As Debbie said, turning on early is not necessarily a blessing. Besides which, showing a lot of crouch/eye at a very young age could indicate a dog who would tend toward clappiness when older (a big generality, I admit). My dog yard borders my pastures, so my pups can see sheep from the start. I really am grateful that they generally don't notice them till a little later--it makes my life a lot easier. Give her time to grow up some and don't worry about what she might appear to be showing (or not) now. J. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted December 5, 2013 Report Share Posted December 5, 2013 There is no "normal" in border collies, saving only that they're not very normal! Don't worry, be happy - that she's not diving under every gate and fence to get at your other animals. She's very young and the fact she sees all these critters every day may simply mean she's comfortable in her environment. I'd rather have a pup that could follow me while feeding and NOT try to squeeze under the fence than one I have to watch every moment or leave at the house.She'll come alone in her own time. Even if she's slow to bloom, a well bred dog is worth the wait. I know an Aussie boy who never even looked at sheep until he was a year old. Now he's the keenest, most natural working Aussie I've ever known. The same holds true with border collies. She'll switch on when she's ready and when it's time. Until then, just enjoy her!Also, don't worry AT ALL if she doesn't show a lot of crouch or eye. My first good border collie, Jesse, was quite loose-eyed and upright, but he could move anything from lambs to rams to cattle. Style isn't everything. ~ Gloria Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Coyote Posted December 5, 2013 Report Share Posted December 5, 2013 My puppy is almost 7 months now. When I first got him at 9 weeks he was showing all kinds of herdy stuff. Then he sort of stopped all of that. And now it's showing up again. He creeps up on everything and runs way out wide. It's fun to watch. I just let him play. Hopefully I will be able to get him on sheep this spring and see what he is doing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GentleLake Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 My puppy is almost 7 months now. When I first got him at 9 weeks he was showing all kinds of herdy stuff. Then he sort of stopped all of that. And now it's showing up again. I once had a pup like that. I bred him, and at 5 weeks old he showed a lot of "herdy stuff" (I love the term!) with goslings I'd just gotten (and were very short lived at my house - filthy things. LOL). Then he stopped, and as Tommy Coyote says of her dog, it showed up again, though I don't remember now at what age. He turned out to be a terrific working dog, though there were a few months that I despaired of his ever amounting to anything at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucker09 Posted December 6, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 Thank you all for the replies! I guess I should've clarified that it isn't that she just isn't showing a crouch or other herding stuff, but rather that she simply is showing zero interest in any stock at all. Showing interest but without a crouch wouldn't have made me question things. But I'm glad to know that what is happening isn't something uncommon! I have no intentions of forcing her to try to be interested in them or doing anything other than just letting her be a pup And I must say even though my males blood immediately turned him into a worker, he has never been too forceful, too much to handle, or going crazy trying to get to all my animals. Guess I'm lucky! Thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red russel Posted December 6, 2013 Report Share Posted December 6, 2013 probably a horrible dog that will amount to no good i tell ya. will most probably have criminal intent and no instinct a'tall. for a small fee i'll be gracious enough to take the little termite off ye hands. most probably be doin ye a favor... ah please don't tank me... it be me civic duty and a blessing to us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tucker09 Posted December 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted December 7, 2013 probably a horrible dog that will amount to no good i tell ya. will most probably have criminal intent and no instinct a'tall. for a small fee i'll be gracious enough to take the little termite off ye hands. most probably be doin ye a favor... ah please don't tank me... it be me civic duty and a blessing to us all. mmmmmm I think I'll pass this time around! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Coyote Posted December 7, 2013 Report Share Posted December 7, 2013 I heard an English Setter owner talk about her dog as being really "birdy." And she was. And she really reminded me of a working border collie. So I started calling it "herdy" and it's a really good description. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.