faoiltiama Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Hello Everyone, I recently accepted a position doing wildlife control on an airport. As a part of the job, I will be given a border collie to harass problematic wildlife in and around the airfield. I am very excited about this job and think its an amazing opportunity, but my one concern is that my fiance and I have two, three year-old male cats. I know that border collies have an incredibly high herding drive which is why they're so good at harassing wildlife, but I don't want the new BC to harass my cats at home. I've been doing a lot of research on how to get cats and border collies to at least tolerate living together if not start to like each other, but I was hoping for a little more input from people with more BC experience. I already plan on getting a crate for the dog to be his/her safe space away from the cats and likewise have a "safe room" set up for the cats. The dog will be kept on a long lead in the house until I have better verbal control over him/her, and I've been practicing and learning all the commands that the dog will come trained with such as "off", "lie down", and, of course, "No!". I've introduced dogs to cats before, just not a border collie, so I know to do slow introductions using doors as visual barriers and to never leave them alone unsupervised. I know to never allow chasing because "once a chase toy, always a chase toy". Our cats are not declawed, so we'll be very strict on keeping their nails trimmed and blunt so they don't hurt the dog if it comes to that sort of confrontation, but I'm hoping to avoid that. I'm hoping that since the BC will be going to work with me Monday through Friday and have a "job" that it will be easier to control his/her herding behavior at home. Is this just wishful thinking? Any further advice to offer? Success stories to share? I don't know the age or gender of the BC I'll be given, but I know they'll probably be at least three years old and fully trained with all the basic herding commands used to harass wildlife. My main concern is that the cats and the dog are all safe and healthy. Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Welcome! Sounds like a great job and a fine opportunity. I think that the best thing is that you are already mentally prepared, and have good management in mind (like the crate and the cat room). From the very beginning, let your dog know that staring at, chasing, pestering, etc., the cats is not acceptable behavior. My dogs are taught a "leave it" command, which I find most helpful in this sort of situation. I sit (or stand) in the kitchen, drop a treat and, when the dog (or pup) approaches it, put my foot over it. As soon as the dog stops trying to access the treat but looks up at me, I tell him that he's good (or, if you use a clicker, click) and give him an even better, more appealing treat. I do this a number of times. It's amazing how quickly a smart dog can learn that "leave it" means just that. If you avoid the behavior in the first place, it will not become an ingrained bad habit. My one dog does this constantly (staring at and following cats) as I did not know how to deal with this initially. Since he is harmless about it, I don't go to the lengths it would take to try and stop him at this point in his life. I am sure others will have better advice. Best wishes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demon Puppy Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 FWIW, border collies and cats can cohabit just fine. My cat snuggles with my two border collies on cold nights. I do the things you mentioned: a cat safe room with a babygate the cat can get under and the dogs are conditioned to not enter that room ever, whether or not the gate is up. That's where the cat food and kitty litter box are. With them and the foster dogs as they came through, I always had the absolute rule that the cat is MY toy and they don't get to play with it, stalk it, or stare at it, and if the cat sniffs their toys or food, the dog just has to let it. However, the defining thing will be your cats' behavior toward the border collie. If it does fun things like hiss and fluff up and run away, well, what dog could resist? Hopefully, the cats have been around dogs and know how to judge when to stand their ground (and when not to). Be careful to control the first several meetings. The ideal is to let the cats around the crate and some of the dog stuff when the dog isn't there, so they can get accustomed to the smell, then wear out the dog (maybe a nice long day of goose work and a big supper) and then let it snooze in the living room (on a dragline) and let the cats come and sniff it and be all spooky and sneaky when the dog is asleep. Then you can down the dog and feed it treats or give it something fun to chew on and let the cats creep around, but be sure to call the dog off of any staring, stalking or excessive interest in the cats. Be aware of any dynamic like the dog guarding food dishes, toys or crate (or you) from the cats. Anything the dog resource-guards against the cat is dangerous to the kitty. I would avoid letting the cat outside with the dog, if you let any of your cats outside. A lot of dogs don't seem to carry inside rules with them outside. There are three main potential areas of concern between dogs and cats: 1. "herding" the cat because they move and are just so much fun to mess with. 2. seeing the cat as a competitor that should be vanquished (because, claws or not, kitty will loose and knock down drag out fight) 3. predatory behavior toward the cat. The first can be managed. The other two are too dangerous and will very likely be fatal to the cat. Just my opinion and experiences - other people may have better ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
juliepoudrier Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 Welcome. Aside from staring/stalking behavior, you can introduce your new dog to the cats just as you would any other dog. If the dog understands corrections like "No" or "Leave it" then you shouldn't have a problem. Because the dog is a trained working dog, it ought to understand corrections, and so carrying that over to interactions with the cats shouldn't be a big deal. It sounds like you're thinking the right things, and your mindset will go a long way toward making for a peaceable kingdom at home with cats and border collie. If you use the search function here you will find a number of threads about introducing border collies to cats. The old search engine didn't allow searches with three-letter words, but if you use "cats" you should find plenty of reading material (and in the advanced search you can use additional search terms like "introduce" to narrow your search further). You could just search the "General Discussion" forum and I think you'd come up with plenty of good reading material. As for indoor/outdoor cats, my dogs understand that it doesn't matter whether the cat is in or out, he's still my cat and must be left alone. Same goes for the chickens and any other small critters that live here. I don't worry about my dogs being out in the yard with cat(s), chickens, or anything else (well, they do seem to kill toads for some reason--can't be pleasant for them). These are mostly working border collies, so even the "work factor" doesn't mean that they can't understand what NOT to work. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejano Posted January 2, 2011 Report Share Posted January 2, 2011 In my experience, it's always been harder to get the cat to leave the Border Collie alone then vice versa.... They do eventually get bored and stop tormenting if the dog doesn't chase them. Liz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokjbc Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 We have a room for the cats but also a baby gate so cats have more room and can choose to come to the "dog-side" when they feel comfortable with it. My cats seem to have a good handle on which dogs are a threat. The heeler we have, who is a jerk with cats and dogs, cannot come within three feet of one of the cats without a angry reaction, hissing and spitting, while both of my border collies stare at and follow the cats around but one cat will snuggle with them on the bed and the other will rub herself all over the dog that's "harrassing" her. A friend of mine had the idea of putting the cat in a crate and correcting the dogs for coming near it. DON'T DO THIS!! Thankfully, she told me about it before she'd done it more than a day and only had one very angry cat to show for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejano Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 A friend of mine had the idea of putting the cat in a crate and correcting the dogs for coming near it. DON'T DO THIS!! Thankfully, she told me about it before she'd done it more than a day and only had one very angry cat to show for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faoiltiama Posted January 3, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 Welcome! Sounds like a great job and a fine opportunity. I think that the best thing is that you are already mentally prepared, and have good management in mind (like the crate and the cat room). From the very beginning, let your dog know that staring at, chasing, pestering, etc., the cats is not acceptable behavior. My dogs are taught a "leave it" command, which I find most helpful in this sort of situation. I sit (or stand) in the kitchen, drop a treat and, when the dog (or pup) approaches it, put my foot over it. As soon as the dog stops trying to access the treat but looks up at me, I tell him that he's good (or, if you use a clicker, click) and give him an even better, more appealing treat. I do this a number of times. It's amazing how quickly a smart dog can learn that "leave it" means just that. If you avoid the behavior in the first place, it will not become an ingrained bad habit. My one dog does this constantly (staring at and following cats) as I did not know how to deal with this initially. Since he is harmless about it, I don't go to the lengths it would take to try and stop him at this point in his life. I am sure others will have better advice. Best wishes! Thanks for the advice on how to train the "leave it" command. I've introduced a puppy to older cats before, but never an adult dog so I'm a bit nervous. This command will come in quite handy. Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sue R Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 You are welcome! If the goose dog doesn't already have bad habits with regards to cats, you will be ready to avoid them starting. If she already does, you can use a combination of training (like using the "leave it") and management (like establishing cat zones/dog zones, as already mentioned by others). I have one dog that stares at cats. Since he is harmless and the behavior is ingrained, we largely ignore it (and the cats certainly ignore him). But, if I had it to do over again, I would have worked from the beginning to avoid this behavior. The dogs are funny - you can have three dogs that are just as intense as each other on stock, and one will be obsessed with cats, one might be totally disinterested, and one might be a cat's best friend. Just because a dog is a "herding" dog does not translate directly into that dog utilizing those behaviors on people, other pets, and so forth. So it may be an issue or a non-issue for you, but you can deal with it. Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vickim Posted January 3, 2011 Report Share Posted January 3, 2011 I brought Whisper, an adult rescue, into my house with a cat. I must be really lucky--she offered to chase the cat just once. I told her not to do it, and she never offered that behavior again. Both the dog and the cat have a zone around them that I can't see (but they are certainly aware of it), and each avoids entering the other's zone. Sometimes they compromise and share their zone, but not too often. It sounds like you know what you need to do. Be firm, be consistant, and expect the behavior you want. Don't underestimate the power of body language, either. My frowny face has absolutely no effect on the cat, but does wonders on Whisper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faoiltiama Posted January 4, 2011 Author Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 Thank you all for your warm welcome and advice! I'll keep you posted on how things go. I'm supposed to be given my dog at the end of January, so I have a bit more time to prepare. Thanks again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloria Atwater Posted January 4, 2011 Report Share Posted January 4, 2011 The dogs are funny - you can have three dogs that are just as intense as each other on stock, and one will be obsessed with cats, one might be totally disinterested, and one might be a cat's best friend. Just because a dog is a "herding" dog does not translate directly into that dog utilizing those behaviors on people, other pets, and so forth. So it may be an issue or a non-issue for you, but you can deal with it. That's pretty much what I have. My old Jesse utterly ignores our cats, and we brought him into our then-two-cat house as a 2-year-old. He just never cared about them one way or another, and yet he's always keen as heck on stock. Young Nick mostly acts like a polite if slightly disinterested roommate to them, occasionally giving an amiable sniff. Yet his sister, Gael, dearly loves to fixate on our cats, but never follows through with doing anything and answers immediately to "leave it!" I'm then just as apt to find her asleep with one of the cats curled against her back. So, I think you're already prepared with all the management and cautionary know-how you need. I'm betting the dog will come with pretty good manners and behavior, since he'll be working out around all sorts of folks, so if you stay on your toes, things should work out fine. Keep us posted, once your goose partner arrives! Cheers ~ Gloria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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